Brinkmann vs TW Acustic

Dear Lewm: I agree with you that there are different kind of distortions. My " term " distortion means any kind of distortion it does not matters the distortion's source.

Now, how is that some persons is " suffering/supporting " distortions on electronics ( heavy ones. ) and not aware off and when a TT has tiny deviation from perfect speed then is aware of it and blame the item mainly because of that when ( for sure ) their past TTs had tiny deviations too especially if were BD ones.

I'm trying to figure what additional information was not disclosed yet on that TW subject that made that kind of " reaction " on the non-perfect speed.

The only thing clear to me is that the manufactturer did not take seriously and in deep the Dev complaints because if I was that TT manufacturer and due the TT high price I think that with or with out reason a customer deserve ( any customer ) a lot better treatment as can be: change the " evil item " for a new unit and that's all. Big mistake not did it because that manufacturer is losting a lot more through the Agon threads that changed that item.

Anyway, you have the idea ( I think? ).

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.

Dear Dgad: Very good point because some of us already posted here about the anomalies/unaccuracies that happen during the recording whole process till we have the LP on each one hands. Yes, it's from the tape where the grooves information comes and certainly does not meets that " perfect speed " we are asking for.

That is part of the whole analog imperfect medium.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.

Are you inferring that SME provides turntables with higher speed accuracy performance to professional musicians and conductors only? That is how I interpret your analogy to the BMW M5 reviewer and the club owners after they complained about performance.

It was just an example that you will find in every situation of real life something comparable like this discussion and that the sentence "...lots of happy owners" isn't worth the time to read. It may sound good, but it can be a lie also. So what....
I don't care about SME, Raven, Seiki, Kuzma, Clearaudio or whatever someone owns, I also know musicians who are very happy with a 1k Kenwood Stereo System, some get a lot of emotion when they hear a performance via their iPod and earplugs....
I believe in brain, the ability to do something right...but that's me

Timeline
The advantage from that unit is mainly, the user can adjust the speed with the VTF, means, a real time job when the record is played. Most other "adjustments" are only useable without VTF, that means, in real life it is a nice toy, but worth nothing.
I bought the Timeline as a tool to optimize my System, first, when I had the Basis Debut, that table was stable, no drift, the way it should be, same with Kuzma Reference and even the 20 year old Seiki is stable like a rock (MY Seiki ....) both speeds, 33 /45 ...I noticed very fast that this timeline will destroy a lot of dreams and it does. I gave it to a few audiophiles and there we discovered how many units can't be adjusted properly, independent from price...was new to me also...
I haven't checked it with a Brinkmann, the owner I know sold it some time ago, but not based on Timeline...but I think Steve from SOS tried one with TL and it is ok...
Ah, before I forget, the main question from all who hate that thing: "Is there an audible difference between a shifting red light and a stable red light behind the Turntable?"
Answer: "It depends.... :-) but yes, normally you can hear it at once, soundstage is deeper, focus is better, transients are more clear....simply less smeared notes.
Modern analog is mainly done cheap. Profit counts...here you can see it :-) But that has nothing to do with bearing, isolation, energy transfer, unleveled armoards ... That is too much I think. There are a lot of customers out there who prefer to believe instead to control what they buy. I have no problem with that, the "manufacturers" needs them...see the car story and I think, you will find something comparable in coffee machines, fridges, Tonearms and so on...
But shooting the messenger is an accepted solution here :-)
In the next Raven thread it will be repeated again and again... this ---> I love my unit...and happy ownership... and the nice guy /bad guy story....
Banana products have the ability to mature at customers place, that is part of tweaking or competence?

Btw. R2R machines were made in a time where engineers did the thinking, probably that is the reason why they sound so different compared to a lot of Turntables?

Raul, I take your point.
Syntax, Another story. I have a neighbor with a different brand of megabuck belt-drive turntable. I will not mention it, because I do think it is a very good sounding high quality product. I was in his listening room when he first tested it with his newly purchased Timeline. As we watched the red dot move steadily across the curtain behind his turntable, he leaped to his feet to adjust the speed controller. This only momentarily worked to halt the inexorable progress of the red dot. Two minutes later, he was on his feet again, and then again and again. (It would have been funny, if the turntable cost $100.) As I could hear no obvious problem due to speed aberration, I suggested that he should just ignore the Timeline so we could listen to music. However, the red dot is very distracting. A week or two later, he reported to me that the maker of his turntable tested the motor controller that is sold along with the table and reported it to be "defective". He also reported that the problem was now "fixed". The story does not end there, needless to say. "Fixed" is a relative term. The Timeline has created some havoc at the elite level among those suffering from audiophilia nervosa. Still, it does tell us "something". I would posit that if a turntable is speed stable enough to look good with the KAB strobe (the most accurate of the strobes because of its battery power), while the stylus is down on the LP, then it is probably "good enough".

So far as I know, R2R machines have their issues with wow and flutter, too. As most know, the famous jazz album, Kind of Blue, with the Miles Davis Quintet, has survived in its popularity for many decades despite the fact that it was mastered from an off-speed tape recording. As a devotee, I am so used to the pitch and tempo of the original that I find the recent release of the corrected speed version to be not nearly as involving. I daresay the original owes some of its staying power to the "dark" feel of the music, imparted by the speed inaccuracy of a tape recorder.

Syntax, I hope it is not a case of because you see it so you hear it! Your hearing must be incredible that you can hear with more precision than Kab strobe. I don't know if that is a gift or a curse. I assume that before Timeline came, you have to always adjust speed by ears then as no strobe would be good enough for you. I shall yield to your hearing ability.

Wait but you say that "it was new to you as well" after you receive Timeline that some turntables cannot hold accurate speed! Is that means that you actually did not know or could not hear that before but suddenly Timeline give you ability to hear better?
I understand your BMW story now, I better talk to Sutherland because I have been cheated.