Entry into tubes

dunno how well the rogue will do regarding bass - i am the new owner of a rogue 99 preamp, tweeked by rogue, & the only thing that makes it listenable in the bass range is the addition of n.o.s. ge 6sn7 tubes - and this is w/a pair of adcom gfa 555's driving a pair of vmps larger subs, w/a pair of electrocompaniet amps driving my bi-amped meret re's. rogue's *upgrade* phillips nos tubes are not very good. i dunno if the latest rogue integrated is an all-tube design or not, but my experience, coupled w/what i have read about their amps, is that their integrated would not be satisfying for you, if it's all-tube. i was fortunate to have a *very* knowledgeable tube-roller locally. http://www.bws-tube.com/ if there isn't one in your area, you should be prepared to deal w/a company like this via the mail, to try & get the response you are looking for, *regardless* of which tubed product you choose. (also, stereo subs will help your sound *immensely*). i would suggest a hybrid integrated, such as the pathos classic one, which combines a tube pre w/solid-state amps. $2k new, i've seen these things for ~$1200 on the used market. (&, they're drop-dead gorgeous!) or, as suggested above, find a separate toob pre & a solid-state amp. or, try a solid-state integrated, such as electrocompaniet or alchemist, that's known for a warm sound. there's currently an alchemist kraken integrated f/s on audiogon for $575, asking price - you would *not* go wrong w/this... doug

Hey Charlie Daniell, I'm not an expert and I didn't spend last night at a Holiday Inn :-), but you asked so here's my 2 cents(actually loosely based on my tube journey).With a $1500 budget I'd spend maybe up to 650 on a decent used tubed linestage or full function preamp which probably retailed in it's day ~1500, throw the remaining 850 at a set of either EL34 or KT 88 older mono block amps- and if they didn't drive the Maggies to my liking, I'd turn 'em and use those bucks to get a set they would. But an essential ingredient would be hours and hours of research (audio asylum good start)-- but that's me. You have a quite nice SS set-up, so you might actually want to hook up with some one who has an analog(tube) system to check it out. I was extremely fortunate to be exposed to tube audio (read- bitten real bad)this way. There are 2 distinct tube worlds -- vintage sound (warm,laidback, rich mids)and modern (transparent, uncolored, slightly forward). Neither being bad, just what your ear prefers. I was flat out floored by the vintage gear I was listening to, that when I listened to newer gear I found it wanting -- not as full and rich as the vintage. So have fun and enjoy the journey. I've met some good people here on mine! --FIREBOTTLES RULE!!!!!! --

Charlie, I agree with some of the above posts, and I am also a tube lover. All of the components in my system except for the speakers and the transport contain tubes. I am a previous owner of maggies (before wife & kids) A couple of suggestions to think about... Beware of powering the maggies with tubes and a budget - I did it (with MG-1As) unsatisfactorily with 50W (Audio Research VT-60) for a while and then switched to 100W (Audio Research VT100) - which was enough power. Also beware of powering maggies with anything EL-34 based - good EL-34 tubes are getting rare and expensive and maggies eat them fast (pre-AR amp I owned) Maggies tend to be rough on tubes because their impedance can dip pretty low, and they are relatively inefficient. I do not have any suggestions for integrated solutions ~$1500, but if you have the patience, audiogon has been turning VT100s in the low 2K range (not for the MKII)....And upgrade with a preamp when more $$ are available.. If you do not have to drive maggies, I would give a the Rogue a shot, or look for a used Audio Research CA-50. If you haven't detected my bias, I am an AR lover, and no -- I have no affiliation with them. I have received no flawless service out of all the various AR gear I have owned for the past 10yrs. Never had to check out the world class service center other than for tubes every 2000hrs. Last suggestion is to spend ~$1200 for a AR VT-60, and an old counterpoint 7.1 pre-amp ~$300 - Easier to upgrade later, the VT-60 is holding value well, can be used as balanced monoblocks with custom cable connections for future upgrades. My humble biased opinions John

YO, I live in Charleston SC (you cant be more than 3 hours away) and there are a couple of dealers in here. Both carry tubed integrated amps, both are run by good people. At your price I would suggest a SS amp to drive the Maggies, though. I was at one of the above-mentioned dealers today, and we put together a nice system using the Maggie 1.6. However it took A PAIR of the Conrad Johnson MV-55s (GREAT AMP)to drive them. These speakers "lika the peppere" if you know what I mean. Another tip, though take my comment with a grain of salt, as you shoult take all others: Be wary of dealing with one dealer and one dealer only. People have a tendency to exhibit a sort of hyper-loyalty to a specific brand, without actually comparing it to anything else. IF it sounds better than what you already have, why should you not buy?? SIMPLE. Because what you have may sound horrible (relatively) and what you want to buy may sound better, but it may be worse than everything else at the same price. I have friends in the business, but I realize that it's in their best interests to sell their gear. Trust their opinions at your descretion, BUT ALWAYS TRUST YOURT EARS AND WALLET FIRST!!!! If you want info on my local shops, feel free to email me. good luck

sedond your opinon is baseless.You where crying about the Rogue before you put 5 hours on it.I have Rouge 66 and 120 Mono's.As for bass i have no problems.They give me more than enough.your problem is the Mid FI Adcom Junk you are using its not the Rogue.Bottom line is it sounds like you dont know what you want and are slagging the Rogue's.like I said you whinned about the Pre before it was even brokin in.Have you put a couple of hundred hours on it yet.