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Center Channels sound crappy

Why do center channels sound so crappy with music?

This is something that absoilutly baffles me...

I was talking to a KEF rep at SoundTrack audio, he said it is becuase they are designed for dialogue more than anything else.
What im wondering, is why can alot of center channels only give marginal preformance with music?
My front KEF Q1's do a fantastic job creating a phantom center channel, the dialogue is crisp and clear. They do a fantastic job on music as well.

Wouldnt it make more sence to just get another KEF Q1 for $225.00 and use that as a center instead of paying 350 for a speaker that does great voice but crappy musical preformance?

I know it was not the "center channel" amp either, it is on a DENON 3803 and all channels are identical, i was playing it with the 5/7ch stereo mode and all the speakers sounded great for music but the center channel really really sucked..

i noticed this with my past DefTech setup as well...

has anybody done a serious comparison between a center channel and a monitor of the same brand with same drivers and heard any vast improvement with the center speak with dialogue?

does it have anything to do with sound dispersion?

----- Slappys disclaimer-----
It was not my intent to offend anybody with the above post, im genuinly curious and hope it does not offend anybody becuase that is clearly not the intent. If so, please reffer to "My Apologies" thread which explains more.
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THANKS IN ADVANCE
slappy
eldartford
4,262 posts
 
edesilver...When playing stereo source material it is true that if your speakers image well, and you can sit in the right place you can't tell if the center speaker is playing or not...even if you walk up to it and put your ear near it (at least with Magneplanars). Even with stereo source material, the center channel has some benefits in a broader and more stable (less sensitive to listener position) soundstage.

However, when you are dealing with multichannel source material, matrix or discrete, the center channel carries sounds (especially dialog) that are greatly attenuated or completely missing from the Left and Right channels. If you play multichannel material with the center turned off you are missing something.
edesilva
768 posts
 
Eldartford... I'll agree that a multichannel source has a specific feed for the center channel, and that its unsatisfying to disconnect your center channel if your system is set up that way. My guess is that most processors allow you to create a phantom center, as mine does, which means you aren't missing anything if your system images well. Frankly, given that most center channels underperform as compared to the L & R front channels, my point is that you are better off with a phantom center than a crappy one, since the center channel carries more information than probably anything else in multichannel set ups.
eldartford
4,262 posts
 
Edesilva...I think we have a semantics problem. When I say "center" I mean where the thing is located, and when you say "center" you mean a particular design of speaker. For music I use, and advocate a center (located) speaker that is identical to the others. I agree that speakers designed for dialog in a HT set up (which may work well for that purpose) are poor for music.
mborner
34 posts
 
Eldartford,
You are incorrect in saying that you are "missing" something with a phantom center channel. Let me explain. If the center channel option is turned off in the pre/pro then it will re-direct ALL of the center channel data to the L & r channels. If the system is set up properly and you are sitting in the sweet spot I doubt you would notice a difference. Just as an experiment I turned off the center channel (not disconnected it) in my pre/pro set up menu and wouldn't you know it, I had perfect center channel sound with no center channel! Most of the time, though, this is not feasible because it requires one person to sit in the sweet spot. Anybody sitting off at even a small angle would not get the full picture. Richard Hardesty who writes the Audio Perfectionist Journals has an excellent article on this. Here's the link. http://www.audioperfectionist.com

eldartford
4,262 posts
 
Mborner...Semantics again! I took "phantom" to mean the sound image that occurs naturally between two good speakers that play the same sound, and which can be very convincing. I think that a better word for what you describe would be "synthesized".
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