2. digital
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Is SACD really this lousy?

Bought a Sony SCD 1 and this is boring me in my system. Have had it for 2 weeks and just cannot get interested. Previously I had a CAL CL2o and we were astounded by how the DVD DAD's sounded-fall into the soundstage, reach out and touch the performers. Also the dynamic range used every bit of the VTL's 275 watts into the Maggies. The 44/16 side of the CL20 was at best lukewarm. This after coming off a Meridian 508 20. Then I tried the Wadia 270/27ix. In my system, all the write ups were proven wrong. Then I went to the Linn Ikemi. It was great except I couldn't forget that sound of the DVD's with the CL20. Sooooo....off I went to get the Sony SCD 1. I don't have a dealer here but trusted it wouldn't dissappoint. WRONNNG! I called Steve Huntley at Great Northern Sound to see if he could do anything. He said it was a great player, it's just that Sony missed the boat when it came to the analog section. He is in fact drawing up a mod to deal with this very thing that he says will approach the Accuphase. That however will cost anywhere from $1500 roonies for the SACD side to $3500 for both. Anybody have any comment on this or am I the only one experiencing disappointment?
jmazur402f
carl_eber
1,425 posts
 
Albert means that music in real life hasn't been digitized. Look, I feel like I'm beating a dead horse here, but only a handful of people seem to know that the SCD-1 has horrible op amps for its output stage! An op amp would destroy so much of the musicality and fidelity of the signal upstream from it, that there's no way the SCD-1 would allow you to hear what the SACD process really sounds like anyhow...It only allows you to experience the "sony sound", and that's not worth listening to except with a Walkman, IMO.
iceravendbd3
43 posts
 
Hi Carl, you have made your point about op-amp shortcomings very clear several times from your posts. I've heard the SCD-1 during the launch. I had a good impression of smoothness and extension both ends. But it was an all Sony setup with Straightwire cables. Digital conversion to anolog using large scale integration (LSI) devices, which includes house "tweaked" op-amps is unavoidable somewhere along the chain. IMO its technically impossible to even attempt to integrate the vast digital content read from the disk using just discrete devices like transistors/tubes alone. Audiogon posters would be naive to believe that Sony in this business, would not tweak in a housesound somewhere; in the case of SCD-1 in the output op-amps. Also op-amps are highly repeatable, cost effective in manufacture and not easily copied (if it's proven successful later on). Why are audiophile interests being compromised for something nothing related to hi-end audio??
carl_eber
1,425 posts
 
DACs are designed many different ways by highend manufacturers, and I was referring to the op amps that comprise the line level output stage. There's no reason to use op amps in this stage, other than to be chaep and stupid in your audi philosophies. Sony has such attitudes, and they primarily are a mass market conglomerate. We all know this, and are not naive about it.
albertporter's avatar
albertporter
4,949 posts
 
David99. My remark about hearing analog when you listen to real music, means live acoustic music, not the giant stereo system on stage at a concert. Although, it is also possible to hear analog from those systems as well. You can also hear analog in many Church's on Sunday, in the form of their live coral group, often accompanied by piano or organ. There are night clubs where live acoustic Jazz is performed. Even classical performances around Christmas time in shopping malls, where Cello, Violin and Piano tempt shoppers to extend their stay. All of these forms I've described are pure analog, in the literal and truest sense. Music emanating from these human powered instruments (including voice) is analog. When a tape recording captures these musical performances, the process begins of either keeping the music analog (as the original) or converting it to digital. However, in the end, the signal has to go BACK to analog for us humans to hear and enjoy it! So, I personally prefer to keep the entire chain analog from beginning to end, and save all the conversions.
slawney
242 posts
 
Perhaps a way of putting it is that the SCD 1 makes good digital "conversions" but wretched analog "signals." It's impossible for it to grasp the movement of the SACD format without letting some of the sound escape.
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