2. cables
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7500 for USED cables? Are they joking?

I've been out of high-end audio for about 8 years, and the thing I am most struck by on my return is the apparent acceptance of power cables, interconnects and speaker cables that cost as much or more than heavy-duty high-end components.

As a now-outsider of sorts, this really looks like the Emperor's New Clothes big-time. Especially power cords, considering the Romex that delivers the A/C to the outlet isn't exactly audiophile quality.

Are people really paying $500 and up for wire? Is this foolishness of the highest order, or is this what people now believe it takes to extract the last percent or two of definition from their components?

What happened? Even buyers of what are now considered "modestly priced" cables would be laughed out of the professional audio world, so why do audiophiles think they need something better than was used to make the original recording? MOST professional recording engineers scoff at the difference between microphone cables that cost $19.95 vs. those that cost $49.95 -- most anything higher is rarely considered at all (the most expensive microphone cable might be $125 for a 20 foot run, and it's laughed at by most of the pros).

I'm not criticizing -- I'm too stunned to draw any conclusions -- I just wondered if anyone has given this much thought.

(At least I understand the home theater revolution -- thank heavens something came along to save the high end manufacturers, although it makes me chuckle to think of someone spending $30,000 to watch the Terminator. It's OK with me.)

Thank you for your consideration,

Mark Hubbard
Eureka, CA
mark_hubbard
sugarbrie
3,854 posts
 
I've heard many many poorly engineered recordings; so who
ever said a recording engineer is an expert?
The recording engineers I know are very frugal types. They are just too cheap to spend more than $20 on a cable. When they make a recording only technical issues matter to them to the detriment of musical considerations. If they had two takes of a song, one perfect technically that are dead musically and the other a musical masterpiece with a few technical glitches, they would choose the technically perfect one to put on the CD everytime. The musical masterpiece is lost to history.
grungle
54 posts
 
There is no doubt that people hear differences, usually improvements, when using expensive/well regarded/designer cable as compared to something more reasonably priced/frowned apon/generic. It has alos been well established (extensivly, with many variations) that these differences disapear when you don't know for sure whether the cable/cord in question is in the system.
It's really a matter of personal outlook what you make of this (or whether you deny one of the points and start tying yourself in knots arguing test protocols and epistemology.)
IMO the only reason this is an issue is that people will pay the...agressive...prices you mentioned.
paulwp
585 posts
 
We seem to have a failure to communicate. Did anyone up there say he compared the Valhalla to "OEM grade cables"?

The point wasnt that recording engineers are experts. It was that there is no more detail, information, air, whatever it is you're looking for from a designer cable than got onto the recording through the ratty old cheap cables the recording engineer used to make the recording.
sean
6,231 posts
 
Paul, you take for granted that all studios are "plummed" with "generic" cables, crappy electronics and use JBL's to mix and master their recordings. That is just not so. While they may not be using the most "expensive" or "technologically advanced" wiring, some studios do actually use "audiophile grade" wiring and audiophile grade equipment to listen to and mix their recordings.

Just for sake of clarity ( and i think that most "regulars" here already know that i feel this way ), i am not saying that "wire is wire". It sure ain't. I'm just saying that what we you pay for and what we get ( especially in this specific area of audio ) may not balance out too well.

As to Tim's comments about me being an "old dog" and not being able to be taught any new tricks, that may be "partially correct". I do have my "beliefs" and think that they are well founded, BUT i am always open to learning. If you don't believe this, go back a few years to Audio Review and dig through the archives. Ozzy ( a regular at AA ) and i went round and round about power cords. He was preaching and i was denying. There were something like 60 posts made between a small group of us within a matter of half a day. I am now a believer that power cords can make a difference, so some things can change. I may be like a piece of "stone" in some ways, but it is at least "soft" stone. Some things DO "sink in" after a while : ) Sean

PS... if something does "sink in" and make a permanent impression after a long period of time, would that make me a "fossil" ???
>
paulwp
585 posts
 
Really? Typical, and ridiculous. I said nothing about "all" studios, and nothing about electronics or speakers. I made specific reference to the "Golden Age of Stereo" (not my own idea by the way but one stolen from an anonymous source). Sure, some studios and engineers pay attention to cable, but right now, the vast majority of recording engineers still rely on generic cable.

My question stands. How is it that designer cables improve what goes into a recording via cheap generic cable? But this is just food for thought. I really don't have an answer, or for that matter a dog in this fight.

I did not address that question to you Sean, and I have no interest whatsoever in your point of view, so I'd appreciate your ignoring my posts.
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