Your opinion on cable spending

i agree with uppermifi....however to get the best out of your source,pre, and amps you do need deecent interonnects and speaker cable and now powercables.

there are some hidden gems in regards to interconnects and speaker cables (used) that have a very strong price to performance ratio

much to my dismay..most interconnects/ speaker cables dont get good till you hit the $600 (new retail) price point for interconnects and $1000 ( 8 foot pair- new retail) for speaker cables.

your most cost savings will be buying used....cable markup is very high and the cable depreciation is very quick. i have yet to hear a killer budget cable ( may someone please prove me wrong on this one )

so the used market is the way to go. however the drawback to used is finding out what works best in your system.

since you are obviously looking to upgrade the sound...what are you looking for ? more bass, resolution, imaging. warmth ..etc ?

that is the real key question- what you may have can improved only by changing one set of interconnects ( the one between the cd to pre is most cruical, then pre to amp, speaker cables, then power cords).

i dont know if you have upgraded your pc's but they do make a difference ( i heard a huge difference wih the very inexpensive wireworld aurora with my api powerwedge- made a believer out of me)- that is my new tweaking path.

also, can you utilize ( keep any exisiting speaker cable / interconnects ?

i have seen too many of my audiophile friends choose to "upgrade" only to downgrade from what they have.....( i admit i have this a couple of times myself)

here is a example of my cable budget that is in my current system ( alll used prices)...btw, i have 4 monoblocs and bi-wired alon speakers (speaker cable combo for the alons was very challenging - they are meant to wired with alon black orpeaus speaker cable)

interconnects:
discovery essence $325
xlo signiture $225
straight wire cresen $390

total $940 ( used.. would be $2250 new)

speaker cable
Mit plus s3 (top) $325
Van den hul revolution (bottom) $225

total $550 ( would be $1750 new)

power cords ( still auditioning)
will probley go chris van haus or wireworld @ $900 ( est)

that brings you up to a total of $2400
( i kinda have a unique situation with addional set of interconects and 2 additional power cords....i am going the least amount i can on the power cords)

hope this all helps !!

mike

Depends on your need. For best possible performance / matching, I would buget up to $500 each for pair of speaker cables, and $500 for each pair of interconnects.

Opinion on cable spending : don't.

I would HIGHLY recommend you consider auditioning a well-brokin-in pair of the Analysis Plus Solo Crystal Oval ICs and spkr cables! You can purchase them and be well within your budget.

You can spend the rest of your life mixing and matching cables. Unless you have some type of constant in the system i.e. a given point of reference, you'll always be playing one type of colouration off of another. In order to minimize this, you have to try to minimize the colourations based upon known and very specific operating conditions and then work from there.

Taking all of that into consideration, there are a few factors that we are already aware of. Input and output impedance varies drastically from any given component to component interphase. No two different components will mate identically or require a feedline ( interconnect ) of the same nominal impedance for this reason. This makes inteconnect selection between two mating components a very specific situation and not open to universal interpretation. Having said that, applying some of what we know about cables carrying audio based signals CAN be applied universally. That is, low series resistance, minimal dielectric absorption, reduced skin effect, consistent signal path length, etc... should all be considered as "standard features" of any given cable. As such, cables using low grade dielectrics or break other "common rules" should be avoided right off the bat.

Given that the parameters involved with the amplifier / speaker interphase remain relatively similar from system to system, we are better off starting here. That is because we already have a pretty reasonable idea of what the output impedance of the amp is going to be ( typically 1 ohm or less ) and what the nominal impedance of the speaker is ( typically 10 ohms or less ). As such, it would only make sense to use the speaker cables as the "cable constant" within the system given the lack of variables from system to system involved.

Taking into account all of the various factors involved with speaker cabling i.e. skin effect, consistency of the signal path, strand jumping, nominal impedance, series resistance, dielectric absorption, linearity over a wide bandwidth, etc... your choices become narrower and narrower as each specific trait or characteristic is examined. That is good though, as it makes it easier to sort through the pretenders that bring their own colourations with them and the true "kings of transparency".

In order to make things simpler, let's look at the electrical characteristics involved one at a time and break things down step by step in an easy to understand fashion. In order to keep this post of reasonable length without repeating the same things over and over, take a look at this thread pertaining to speaker cable design and linearity over at AA. There are a few posts that i've made there that go into specifics.

By using one reference cable within the system that all the signal must pass through, and we can electrically prove this cable to be low in colouration / self induced signal degradation, we've made things a LOT easier on ourselves. Not only have we taken a step towards improved system linearity, but we are no longer playing one colouration from one cable off of another cable to try to balance things out. By keeping the speaker cable as linear or "electrically transparent" as we can, we get a better view of what the other equipment / cabling auditioned within that system is contributing. If you alter one component / cable at a time, you get to see what those contributions are on an individual basis. Not only is this a far more logical approach, it typically ends up in a far more cohesive presentation with a lot less guess-work involved. System building now has a plan of attack with known specifics. Now you can more easily identify other goals or traits within the system that are desirable / undesirable and weed things out.

With all of that in mind, it is quite possible that you might not "prefer" a linear set of speaker cables. Due to poor design of your speakers, your amplifier or the fact that they are not a good match for each other electrically, it is quite possible that an "electrically neutral" or "sonically invisible" speaker cable reveals these flaws. In such a case, don't shoot the messenger just for bringing you the bad news. You can either go about things the "right" way and correct the situation by replacing poorly designed components OR "band-aid" the situation by discarding the neutral cables and using cables of lesser pedigree to add their own sonic colourations. That choice is obviously up to you. As we've seen in these forums more often than not, most "audiophiles" choose the second route because they don't know how to go about the first, more logical path.

The bottom line is that you want something that sounds good to you. If you can do that, more power to you. If you can do it while maintaining high levels of linearity aka "accuracy", all the better. Sean
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