SACD my thoughts at this time.....................


I have been on other threads accused of being consistantly negative on SACD as a format.
I'll put my full thoughts on the format here so those members with differing views can express their issues with my opinions.
Hopefully it can be archived and new posters can be directed to this thread.
I also don't claim to know all the answers so others can offer more information or contradictory evidence.

It's long been my contention SACD will probably survive as a niche Audiophille format.
I do not see it breaking into the mainstream nor do I see a time when the majority of releases make it onto SACD.
Of course I could be totally wrong and this is guesswork at this stage in the game.

Also as a music nut with an interest in audio replay I do not rule out further down the line owning a main replay machine that gives me SACD capability to go along with my higher end Redbook capability at this stage.

I'll break my points into main headings.

1.SOFTWARE QUALITY AND LACK OF NEW RELEASES/NEW MUSIC.
Clearly the number of SACD's available are increasing but is it enough?
Sales have risen also.
My opinion is that the large rise in sales is related directly to the large reissue sets of Dylan,The Stones,The Police and the mega-selling DSOTM by Pink Floyd.
These hybrid releases will tie in strongly with my argument on my second and sixth headings.
But the success of these releases lies in their ability to be played in most CD players.
Even pro-SACD members do seem at times to be worried by the quality of some SACD remasters or releases.
A major boo boo in trying to break the format.
Most importantly for me also is the close to complete lack of releases that are new and indeed non-Audiophile related.
Surely another boo boo.
The movement on software in general terms has been too slow.
Whilst no doubt some will cite CD quality and early problems however SACD does not offer the new intial convienance over vinyl CD did.

2.CHEAP MACHINE SYNDROME.
I bought my DVPSN900 on the reviews stating that it was a good audio machine as well which highlighted SACD superiority over Redbook.
It is but the difference between the Redbook and SACD replay is not noticeable to my ears nor others who have heard it.
Surely this is catastrophic for the format?
A dip in the water buying machines such as these will leave potential SACD progressive adopters unimpressed.
Sony has clearly introduced many cheaper SACD players over the last few years.

3.AVAILABILITY OF PLAYERS.
This one will sound daft to most Americans but when I was considering a higher end SACD machine to hear,there was nothing in my price range available in Glasgow,a major city in the UK and probably the biggest hi-fi city outside of London.
None of the big Audio stockists in the city have had much success in selling players.
I wouldn't doubt in a lot of European cities this is similar.
I've also not heard a single UK dealer rave about the format,maybe for the same reasons,my local dealer constantly turns down SCD-1's for trade in because he's had difficulty moving them.
American Audiophiles maybe don't realise that their market is a lot more vibrant despite the economic gloom.
Seems here in the UK after the intial burst of SACD there is a large gap in the availability market which hasn't been filled.

4.NEW PLAYERS
Outside the elite world of the likes of Emm Labs etc it seems the new players have been indifferent.
Doesn't the mediocre reviews/feedback of such big boys as Linn and Krell not bring another problem.
This month's Hi-fi+ reviews the new Classe Omega (£12K!)and describes it's Redbook playback as mediocre.
Shouldn't we by this stage seeing the technology drift down and be wowed by the new players?
Will the new Sony make a difference?
5.OTHER FORMATS
Clearly another big issue is the likes of DVDA.
With new generations adopting different types of software,is there any place for SACD?
Even the humble CD seems to have a reasonable future at this stage purely as the dominant format to buy new music on.
Of course it too is under threat but does anybody really think SACD will bypass CD?
6.HYBRID DOUBLE-EDGED SWORD.
Imagine you are reasonably interested in sonic reproduction but have a moderate to low-end system and you've just bought a newly remastered SACD hybrid of some classic.
If you notice a big jump in the CD quality will that intrigue you on SACD quality or will you think I'm not going to spend x$ on a new SACD player when I'm getting benefits where I am.
If you read a bit about it you might consider those who have heard the differences on older recordings to be very slight.
SACD worth the investment?

7.REDBOOK QUALITY ON SACD PLAYER.
Is this an issue?
I think this is key where Audiophiles are concerned.
Will a $3k SACD machine match a Redbook only player in Redbook replay.
It was this issue which ultimately led me away from trying to kill two birds with one stone.
A problem for me here in here the UK but what about in America where the overall selection is better?

8.COMBINATION EFFECT
It's my contention that SACD has too many different issues and unknowns at this stage to make anyone think that it's future is certain.
I'm sure I will hear a lot about Sony's investment and their copyright worries but will that matter if the format does not sell or grow sales?

Let's here your views-those who await further developments before investing in SACD,those who have early adopted and got out of the format and those who love it,embrace and believe it has a long future.
ben_campbell
Ears... I guess we buy different DVD discs. Most of mine are "audiophile" labels from Europe purchased via internet, and they have small cases (and large price tags). Apart from the larger size, which may mean new storage facilities, don't you agree that the big DVD cases are much better than those old flimsy "Jewel" cases that come with CDs?

The setup part of playing DVD-A needs a video display, but so does setup for SACD. Once the setup is done it isn't needed each time you play a disc. I first needed video for setup of my Rotel SS Processor, so I invested all of $63 in a dedicated 13" TV set which is simply part of the audio equipment rack. No problem.
Eldartford, I would prefer the normal case for storage but will not let it deter me from buying them.

My biggest complaint is no redbook layer on the dvd-a format.

I have never had to use video for sacd set up, whether 2 channel or multi channel whith any player including universals but now I am nit picking.

My 4k c2 that is equal to the McCormack map-1 all analog multi channel preamp for non digitized multi channel as compared by Widescreen Review is now up for sale as I will not be supporting multi channel in either format.
I will support 2 channel hi rez only.
I spent a lot of money giving multi channel a fair shot whith audiophool speakers and cables all the way around, not to mention a new multi channel amp.

I spent well over 12k to add 3 channels and give multi channel hi rez a shot and urge others to try it whith a receiver or cheaper gear first before spending any large amount.
I highly doubt so called "Audiophile Labels" would make a big enough difference for multi channel hi rez software as far as multi channel goes.

Like I said, I will continue to buy both formats but only in two channel.
Ears...If you insist on only two channels, DVD-A gives you that via a mixdown. Remember that the "stereo" CD is also a mixdown from a dozen or more channels. Audiowise, such a 2-channel DVD-A signal is exactly like a CD except that there are 24 bits instead of 16, and a sample rate of 96 KHz instead of 44.1 KHz. (Can't hurt). Given this capability, the only reason for a separate redbook layer is for marketing to people who lack suitable players. However, this is a valid reason, and the DVD-A spec will soon be changed to provide for a redbook program on the flip side of the disc.
DVD-A spec will soon be changed to provide for a redbook program on the flip side of the disc
I don't believe that has been finalised yet.

Regards,
Metralla...Not finalized, but inevitable. I hear that disc thickness in a few existing players is the only hang up.