Amplifier match for MM de Capo i's

Hi,

I'm using a VAC Avatar w/ my de Capos. 27W in triode, 60 in ultralinear. I find that triode is fine, and preferable, w/ female vocals, most jazz and small classical groups. With the stock tubes, I almost never ran in UL because I didn't like the sound as much. Now that I've switched to NOS Mullard tubes, I find I like UL a lot more, especially w/ rock or symphony music. My point is, I feel like the de Capos benefit from the extra power when listening to such music, and I now mainly listen to the VAC in UL when I know I'm going to listen to symphony or rock music. (Contrary to popular belief, the VAC is not switchable on the fly, and switching while it is powered up can damage the amp.)

By comparison, when I had Spendor 3/5s, I felt I never had a problem w/ the VAC in triode at 27 W, that it was always enough power, even though those speakers are a lot less sensitive "on paper". The difference is that the de Capos go significantly lower in frequency response. I think that the 3 db point is rated at 44 Hz, but the UHF review I saw said that they roll off slowly, and have real energy down into the 30s (I believe the 24 db pt. was in the 20s!!) With that kind of response possible, I think the 3As benefit from the extra power. I don't know how the Manley compares w/ an Avatar, but I can tell you that the Avatar has the ability to generate some real authority w/ the de Capos, esp. in UL, in my 13 by 15 ft. room.

Terry

I am a huge fan of these speakers. (I own the non-'i' version.)

The best choice for amplification depends on your listening preferences, as Terry alluded to, but also on your listening style. However, based on my experience, I don't think 5 watts would be enough.

What kind of classical do you listen to? If you tend to listen to chamber music, lieder, 18th/19th century keyboard repertoire, you can probably do with around 50 watts. If you listen at low levels in a small room, perhaps even less. Definitely try before you buy.

If you listen to Romantic and 20th orchestral music, opera, large choral works (requiems, choral symphonic works, etc.), particularly if you listen at realistic levels, the De Capos will definitely benefit from all the power (within reason) you can throw at them.

I'm currently using a 150-watt solid state amp. It's certainly not the best choice (for example, a 150-watt tube amp would probably be better), but this speaker is not the meek SET squeaker that many assume it is. Properly powered, it reproduces symphonic music (Rite of Spring, anyone?) and b-i-g voices (think Jessye Norman as Judith in Bluebeard's Castle) with authority and impact.

I tend to listen to this kind demanding repertoire at (or, with guilt, above) concert levels in a medium-sized room. So, obviously, my power requirements are higher.

And, as Terry mentioned, the extended bass repsonse is much more demanding of amplifier power. If you listen to organ music or repertoire that includes large orchestrations with tymps or bass drums, you will not get the best results with a low-powered tube amp that recoils from low-frequency information.

In my room/system, I can hear the fundamentals of 16- and 32-foot pipes. No, they are not rafter-shaking; the laws of physics still apply.

Good luck.

A couple additional points and suggestions:

I agree that the Atma-Sphere S-30 would be a great match, albeit with a power limitation.

I agree that Bryston (in my experience) would be plenty powerful, but lack finesse and warmth. I have not really heard the new SST series, though...

At the last Montreal show, Reference 3A demonstrated with Copland (because the distributor carries both), using a new integrated amp with a tube pre and ss amp stage. Not sure on the price, but nice-sounding (not fantastic in my book), and plenty powerful (I think the integrated is 80-100 watts).

I am itching to hear my dc's with the c-j MV-60se (or maybe two of them). I haven't heard the combination, but the MV-60 has sounded sweet and musical (if not particularly authoritative) in a number of systems; the SE version is supposed to add some bass control and impact--Hi Fi + gave it a Product of the Year award, as well.

Rogue Audio might have some mid-power amps in your price range used.

I've also heard of good results powering dc's with the Audio Aero Prima hybrid integrated.

Good luck.
-cy

Hi,

A follow-up and a question. While my VAC and Ref 3As are definitely a step-up from anything I've owned in the past, I find myself wanting even more dynamics and "naturalness" from my system. I've been leaning towards selling the de Capos and getting perhaps a larger pair of 3As, like the ones listed for sale on this site now. However, Cyounkman raises an interesting issue about power. I'm not sure if upgrading the de Capos, or the Avatar, would give me more performance for the present. I've enjoyed the VAC w/ several speakers, and it certainly has better dynamics and openness than any of the cheaper tube amps I've owned in the past, like Anthem, Golden Tube, Antique Sound. However, I'm beginning to think that a 100 watt + tube amp would coax even more out of the de Capos. Another option is to upgrade my Avatar to an SE, for an extra grand. Several Avatar owners have confirmed what Kevin Hayes of VAC told me -- that the SE is more transparent and dynamic than the standard Avatar. Or, I could sell the Avatar and pick up a VAC 100/100, since they have been discontined and are now discounted. Any thoughts? (I think I will post this in the amp section as well). Thanks,
Terry

Terry, I was in touch with Ernie aka "Subaruguru" about the VAC and he mentioned something about it's very high output impedance. That may have something to do with your "dissatisfaction".

I've decided to go with the Cary sli-80. (I loved my slp-50A preamp) I guess we'll see what happens.