Anyone hear Thiel CS1.6?

Also to a large extent (not 100%, I know), JT seems to be reaching for the goal of engineering and manufacturing separate, application-specific drivers for each of his different speaker designs. Not inexpensive, to be sure, but probably the most valid approach if you can do it.

Tweek, I happen to think that $2,000 is very realistic for a speaker that, while it doesn't do everything (what does?), goes about what it *does* do with what sounds to me like fewer errors overall than many other designs that may do one or two things better for the price.

Cdc, JA has known and acknowledged for a long time that he isn't properly equipped to take the true measure of first-order designs like Thiel or Dunlavy, which makes it all the more curious why he often *does* seem to "hear his measurements" when it comes to these speakers (and I guess you might say his own Revels too, for that matter, but I wouldn't know about that one). Also odd, then, that he used to own a pair of my own CS2 2's as references, especially since I thought I heard the smaller 1.6 do certain things better, and came away with the impression that it might well be the more successful design overall, figuring in size and (adjusted) price.

Zaik, One purpose of this web site is to help guide us products that are real performers. I find your posts perceptive and entertaining. So speaking in a general sense, not to you... No amount of well!, expertly!!, talently!!! written hype by the "hi-fi" mags will get me to buy any product. The products i'm most interested in are not advertized in the mags. This is an open forum, but hopefully we can learn how to decipher firm opinions from airy hype.

Well, I'm aware that there will always be audiophiles who won't consider anything from a brand that has 'hit the bigtime', so to speak. Even if they are still an exclusively audiophile brand. But there are sometimes *reasons* why a certain brand may be known to everyone, get good reviews (not that JA's is very much that, but Tom Miiller's was), and have a respectable advertising budget. Thiel's own ads, in particular, could never be fairly accused of getting by on 'hype' - to the contrary, their ads tend to be some of the most informative concerning their products (remember those things?) of any in the industry. Sure, they run the reviewer's quotes for a while, but you pretty much have to do that in this game, and today's 'underground' brands will do the same, when/if they can.

Tweek, I thank you for your complement about my posts. I'm glad no amount of magazine writing, however glowing, will get you to buy a product. I myself have disagreed with the mag 'consensus' many times. But I have to say, I do think I detect an air of reverse-snobbery in your statements. You have often on this site advocated (sound unheard) products you have only seen on an obscure (to me, anyway) manufacturer's web page. Is that 'hype'? Will it get you to buy a product? My friend, I suspect the main reason you chose to play devil's advocate in this thread was because of the presence of the name 'Thiel'. But as ever, let us know what you think if you actually get a chance to hear these.

This is a reply to Zaikesman comments above. This is the last paragraph from a "Soundstage" review of the Totem Arro speaker: In all, another superb speaker from Totem, one that delivers on all that you would expect from looking at it and that also has some surprises as well. In fact, so much bass comes from these little cabinets that I have to wonder if the laws of physics are different in Canada. I bet you’ll be surprised too.

...Todd Warnke
todd@soundstage.com

The best thing to do is go out and listen to them or any speaker system before making judgement or purchases. I agree with you that it is hard to believe that Totem, Audio Physics, Proac can make a wonderfull sounding full range small speaker.

RB, I don't know what you think I said for you to "agree with" regarding your last sentence above, because I made no such comments. For the record, I do not find it any harder to believe that those brands should accomplish what you state than I do Thiel.

I looked up Todd's review, and no measurements were included, so I can't speculate on his ability to ascertain anything when he says that the Arros got 'below 50Hz' in his room when placed near a boundary, but I do not doubt this is possible, it's just a question of balancing roll-off, dynamic capability, and room reinforcement. He also campared the Arros to another, slightly larger small speaker, and though he preferred the Arros overall, he noted that the other speaker could provide more bass dynamics, as you would expect.

So while the health care system in Canada may indeed be different, the laws of physics are comfortingly the same. I think his subjective impression of satisfying bass for such a tiny speaker basically serves to illustrate my point from the above post, and indicates the skills of the speakers' designer. Since I've never auditioned the Arro (any Totem product, for that matter), and never made any claims concerning their sound quality, there's nothing here for you to be defending them from. I'm sure it's as fine a speaker as you obviously feel it is.