2. amps-preamps
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Major help needed in Input and output impeadance..

Okay, so if you have a 10 kohm or 10,000 ohm input in amplifier terms, what are the parameters for the output on the preamp? I see anything ranging from 50 ohm to 600 ohm in preamps outputs. And see many amplifiers from 10 kohm , 20 kohm, 30 kohm, 50 kohm etc... I know there is a rule of thumb but what is weird Is most of the manufactures I see building amps with 10 kohm up to like 50 kohm are building preamps with only about 50 ohm outputs.... nothing near what some other manufactures use between 220 ohm to about 750 ohm.

I will have a 600 ohm out pre soon and my amps are only 10,000 ohm inputs. so what does this mean? it almost seems that the 600 ohm may not be compatible in looking at the matching most manufactures use as they are all much lower output impeadance in general vs. my preamp, so what happens, I get less gain, more noise, what can be a problem if you have mismatched impeadances between these two components? Or is all this irrelevant and I just need to get the preamp and listen and not worry about it? But I swear I read something about this topic at some time and really want to make sure I know what I am doing.

Thanks, Ps. in my post I did use K- for increments of 1000 if anybody got confused when I wrote out the whole number and then started using the abbreviation with 'K'
matrix
matrix OP
305 posts
 
Gmood1, Thanks I do understand the standard is 2 volt, but I can assure that my Wadia CD player in fact puts out the pro audio standard voltage of 4 volt at the RCA's As well as XLR, as why it much more full and powerful sounding than most players. As for speaker frequency, Mine Go 16hz to 25,000hz, no problem there either, whether it can be proven we hear or feel it is another story, but I guess the frequency's exist thats why they have products built beyond the call of duty. Not sure why but all the top manufactures flagship Preamps are in the 10hz or even 5hz up to 100 khz, or 200 khz, is it necessary? , probably not but I guess these are the flagship specs. cause yes the run of the mill and even fairly high end pieces only claim 20 hz to 20 khz... Who knows, but thanks I will see what this preamp does I was just concerned of the impeadance match, but it should be okay.
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
Hi Matrix,
I have no doubt the Wadia puts out up to 4 volts I was more or less talking about why 2 volts is more than sufficient in real world applications.Sorry you may have misunderstood me.As far as those flagship specs go.Look a little deeper and you'll see equipment that's not held as flagships (because of price)that have these qualities.IMHO it's more to do with well engineered gear than it having a flagship stamp.Not sure if the Wadia has this feature. But if you want fuller sound and dynamics have a modifier to put inline output transformers(bypassing the caps or op amps on the analog output of the player).That's if it uses dual differential Dacs like some Denon,Pioneer and Esoteric players.. This is what gives you the full potential of the player's dynamics and transparency.Most stock equipment regardless of cost doesn't have this.You will find it in some DIY gear though..since manufacturing cost isn't an issue.

Well enough babbling on my part... enjoy the new preamp.

Good listening
matrix OP
305 posts
 
I know what your saying, I just was reiteratting the fact for some reason the "Flagship" pieces seem to spec. frequency out of this world, whether it will help anything is another question. Actually thats funny I did just have the Wadia modded, with a new clock all caps replaced with Rubycon Cl/Cz (supposedly better than Blackgates, but Rubycon makes the blackgates so I don't know), WBT next Gen jacks, Silver Rectifier bridges etc... and they told me the output stage in the wadia is about as simple as it gets with one Opamp and thats it, they believe it is very good analog out stage already, but could get the silver transformers put in but we are talking a 1000.00 mod, and I am skepticle going that far to be honest.
Thanks for the tips, I hope the Preamp works out Too!
jeffreybehr's avatar
jeffreybehr
805 posts
 
Voltage-gain/sensitivity issues are different than impedance 'matching'. The rule of thumb on output/input impedances, the original issue, is 1:20. The 'rule' indicates that if the 2 impedances are at a ratio of at least 1:20, the preamp will be able to deliver full Voltage into the amp. If the ratio is less than 1:20, the preamp MAY not be able to deliver full Voltage and/or the preamp/amp system may be more susceptible to the characteristics of interconnect cables than we'd like.

600 Ohms:20K-Ohms is a ratio of 1:33 and should present NO Voltage-delivery or cable-dependency problems.

GENERALLY, one would like very low output impedances and relatively high input impedances, but there are tradeoffs to both. Tubes, generally, are high-impedance devices, and some designers and audiofools believe there are compromises inherent in the use of cathode followers, the most-common method of reducing output impedance.
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matrix OP
305 posts
 
Jeffreybehr, I do have a Tube Hybrid preamp, But you lost me a little... So I should be capable of full output with 600 ohm preout's, and 10,000 ohm inputs on the amp? Sorry you used a spec double that as an example and got a little confusing, thanks
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