Integrated amp for my Sonus Faber Guarneri


Need a good advise here since the possibility of listen before i buy is limited. No hard-rock fan, else all kind of music. On my short list at the moment are Pathos (Classic), Sugden, BAT, Creek, Edge, Lavardin, CJ.
eibe
Hi D-I-L-Eye,

Continuing to do your homework! i am not surprised by your findings...the amp will provide detailing and quality based on amplification...but not a massively different soundstage nor boost in bass, at least not compared with our current amp.

as to the trial sub, i have not heard this one, but did some background checking on it and read thru the specs on the Velodyne website. In general, this sub should give you an idea of what is possible, but it is not a sub that will really be up to the quality of sound that your G produces. but as a test of whether the sub does it for you, it should suffice. some pointers based on the specs:

1. there are 2 ways to test the sub...use its internal crossover, or dont. try both.

2. if you use the internal crossover, use the line-level inputs...not the speaker cable connections. in other words, interconnects from pre-amp to sub...and then interconnects from sub to amp.

i would use the 80hz cut off, not the 100hz cut off on high pass. since it is a gentle 6db slope, i would probably set the low pass around 45-55hz on the sub...too much higher and you may find it "bleeds" up into the high bass territory (100hz) and then you get a muddier sound.

3. if you avoid the internal crossover, then again use interconnects and line-level inputs. the easiest way to do this is to get a pair of RCA adaptors which have one input and two outputs. that way, you stick the adaptor in the back of the preamp...with the 2 outputs, you put one pair of interconnects from preamp to amp, and one pair from preamp to sub.

again, set the low pass crossover around 45-55hz and play around with the volume setting to get the right blend.

in the end, this will give you an idea of what is possible...though the bass quality and quantity will not be the same as using the Velodyne DD-series which is their top level (and appropriate for use with G).

good luck and let us all know how it goes.

it sounds like a bit of trouble...but in reality, if you get the Velodyne to trial, just make sure to ask for a pair of interconnects and the adaptors. (if your preamp has 2 preamp outs, then you of course do not need the adaptors). My preamp happens to have two outs, so i use one to amp, and one to the sub. (i still use sub even with the SF strads) and it makes a noticeable difference. but my low pass crossover is probably closer to 35hz.

good luck!!!!!!!!!!
Deaf, You should look to the preamp... as I said before, as the culprit regarding your "smallness" of the soundstage! Luckily, I am familiar with the Mac C-40 and therein lies your problem. Pity you were changing amps, but didn't think to change preamps..:0(
In my system the GH's are anything but small in their ability to reproduce a soundstage. Mini-monitors, which these are in a sense, are well known for their imaging abilities...IMHO the GH's have this in spades.
Hello Loydelee21 - I finally got the sub, but I need some more help with the connections.

The sub has low-pass input and high-pass output RCA jacks.

Connecting the low-pass RCA input on the sub to the pre-out output of the pre-amp section of my integrated amp (McIntosh MA6800) gives me low, rumbly, thumpy bass, the volume and low-crossover point of which I can adjust. This just sounds basically like the GH's as they were, but with some rumbly bass underneath.

I tried the sub connected this way at the shop with some screechy little "Mission" speakers, and it sounded much more integrated than what I'm getting at home with the GH's, so I imagine I need to also connect the high-pass crossover as well.

What I don't get is where on the integrated amp to connect the high-pass output from the sub. Your #2, above says to connect the line-level outputs to the AMP, but the manual says to connect those to the "line-in PRE-AMP input," while my amp has no RCA connection labeled as such.

The amp has the following RCA inputs:

Phono/Aux, CD1, CD2, Tuner, Tape1, Tape2, Tape3, Video.

It also has an "pwr amp in" set of jacks next to the "pre-amp out." Should I connect the high-pass line output to this "pwr amp in" jack instead of the "line-in PRE-AMP input" that the manual cites?

I tried that, but it doesn't seem to make much difference in sound.

As for your suggested wiring #3, since mine is an integrated, I assume I don't need the RCA splitters, am I right?

Sorry to ask such dumb questions, but I certainly don't want to somehow damage my new amp or the GH's.

Getting desparate in terms of time, with just 3 days to go with my trial and wifey adamant that I should send the GH's back.
Hello Again Lloydelee - I bottle of excellent wine is in order for you!

The lousy quality subwoofer test worked! It took me some emergency tweaking after figuring out the wiring, but I got the sub to blend well enough to convince my ever-so picky wife that the Guarneri is better than the Yamahas, with the sub (which she calls a "bandaid").

I thank you profusely for your patient and clear help. You knew exactly what the priority items were to approach first for my problems with the GH's, and your solutions were economical as well as practical.

If I figure out where in our small and ancient Japanese house to store the three shipping containers (the wooden one for the speakers "will make a nice coffee table," while the one for the stands a "nice coffin" for "someone" as she said when when I first got them home), I'll be able to keep them.

Little does wifey know what long train of equipment upgrades await. Thanks for your help with that aspect, too, Daveyf.

Rachmaninoff on a Bodendorfer on "A Window in Time" sounds rich and full now with the sub, and more like a real piano than through the Yammies, as we tested live against our modest piano here.

Pandolfo's cellos on "A Solo" are really rich and with subtle tonality, much different than I had heard before.

What's not great yet is percussion in general, which is all too soft, and I can't get Cassandra Wilson and her band on "New Moon Daughter" to sound good at all yet. All their rich low sounds come out as dead "thuds." Just getting started...lots to do...
Fantastic!!!!!!!!!!! that is great news, and well worth all the hard work and effort you put into it. If I was of any help, i am glad for it, but you did all the hard work. Many congratulations and i am really pleased for you...as i think all of us A'Goners are out who have discovered new levels of sound and satisfaction.

If you wish to explore the sub integration in more detail now, feel free to keep posting here any questions you may have. happy to help if i can.

on your comment about percussiveness of the bass, it sounds like you probably have a little more "adjusting" to do given how quickly you have had to work just to get the sub set up.

Now that you can fine tune with less time pressure, i wonder about your flooring...specifically if the percussion is too soft, it might be that the floorboards are "flexing" underneath. (It might could be the sub placement, or just the sub itself.) One "inexpensive test" to possibly "sharpen" the bass is to put 4 tennis balls underneath...one under each corner. The bass will get lighter...so just turn up the volume a bit to match...but the bass itself (can sometimes) become sharper , clearer and more percussive.

just a thought. keep posting! and many congrats again.

Lloyd