Tube rolling, Macintosh MC275 Mk IV


But first, I just got the following email from a friend with a new Mk IV (driving Vantages) who had just tried a few NOS 12AX and 12AT tubes I mailed him (he knows who he is ;--)
WOW, I was not prepared for what I was hearing, the first thing that came to my mind was"snap" the music came at me with an energy that was not there before. I soon realize that the music was a lot more dynamic. Meaning there was more treble energy yet still maintain a quality that was silky smooth. Yes there was more detail and nuances that was not previous heard. I wanted to go through my favorite recordings to hear what I have been missing. There is further separation between instruments with ample amounts of air that only enhances the listening experience. In other words I like it, I will listen more tonight and tell you about the improvements. I can see why tube rolling can be fun
I've done some extensive listening/rolling, and have included friends and neighbors in the project -- some with even better hearing than I. Here are my/our conclusions from tubes (including the stock tubes) actually auditioned so far. All twin triode tubes (AX's and AT's) had matched triodes. All pairs of tubes (AT's and KT88's) were matched as well:

12AX7
RCA -- 1957 smoothplate, blackplate, longplate (new, tested over 100%)
Amperex -- Orange Globe, made in Harleen Holland (tested 95%)
Telefunken -- Smoothplate, greyplate (tested 90%)
Mullard -- not included (yet)
12AT7
RCA -- 1957 ribbed, greyplate (new, tested over 100%)
Amperex -- not included (yet)
Telefunken -- ribbed, greyplate (new, tested over 100%)
Mullard -- tried, but not fully A-B'd
KT88
Penta Labs -- KT88SC, new matched quad, (tested over 100%)
GE UK -- NOS: GEC, Genalex, Gold Lion/Monarch (not yet, maybe one day soon if I'm lucky)

Tube groups were rotated in all possible (at this time) combinations, using the Diane Schure/Count Basie Orch. GRP-LP, Track: "Travelin' Light". (system link below.) It was fun. Tedious, but fun! There were some combos that were very close sonically, but the unanimous, winning configuration (after many, many "let me hear that agains") was:

12AX7: RCA -- 1957 smoothplate, blackplate, longplate
12AT7: Telefunken -- ribbed, greyplate
KT-88: Penta Labs -- KT88SC, solid plate, 3-getter

Better than a MC275 MKIV, with stock tubes, out of the box? You have absolutely NO IDEA !! If you want to give it a try, this will save you some time and money; at the very least, give you an excellent place to start ;--)
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128x128nsgarch
Another happy Mac owner (he has an MC2102):
Hi Neil, Just got back from Jamaica and my NOS from Marty were waiting for me. I just rolled in the Telefunkens 12ax7's and I want to tell you....wow. The improvement is unbeleivable in all parameters, especially with mid-quality recordings that were rather flat, (compressed?). They have opened up with much more detail and depth....quite a treat! I still have the RCA 12ax7's, Tele 12at7's, and 8 new Penta Labs kt88sc's to try out... expecting more great results. Thanks for steering me in the right direction, especially with Marty. Regards, John
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the gain differences i noticed in the preamp, were of minor consequence. what happens in the amp if i substitute 12ay7 anf/or 12at7 for the 12ax7, will the changes in gain be of more concern than those accruing from the same substitution in the preamp ?

thanks
Tennis, you can sometimes substitute differently numbered tubes in circuits without trouble (always check with the manufacturer first!) but then you'd be comparing apples to oranges sonically. Guitar players often substitute these lower gain tubes in their amps just so they can over-drive them and get the distortion effects they want. But I can't understand doing that in an audio amplifier; it seems counterproductive to me.

"Tube rolling" generally means trying different brands of the same number (and design) tube, for the purpose of improving/adjusting the sonics of the amp/preamp/tuner. Substituting tube "types" is not the same thing.
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changes in gain structure can sometimes affect the performance of a stereo system. i have been told that 12at7 and 12ax7 tubes were interchanged, by "accident" with no harm to the tubes or amplifier. it is possible that using 12ay7 might provide a preferred presentation than a 12ax7.

our hobby is based upon personal preference. "playing around" with 12 volt tubes may be a way of attaining a "sound" that is desired.
"our hobby is based upon personal preference. "playing around" with 12 volt tubes may be a way of attaining a "sound" that is desired."

I would think, in this case anyway, the "personal preference" part would come when selecting the amplifier in the first place. If one has to go so far afield as to substitute 12V filament tubes for 6V to achieve certain results, maybe one should consider a different amp? But, to each, his own . . . . ;--)