Tubed Pre match with a Spectron Musician IIISE?

Radicalsteve, what is the rest of your set-up?

Sonic Frontier, too bad they are gone they had some really nice pieces and I'm sure if they were still around they would be top contenders and on my list to own.

I was just about to pull the trigger to get a pair with both up grades but in the back of my mind for what ever reason this little voice kept saying wait, just wait and be patient.

Then I read Dob's information above making reference to just being in Toronto and hearing a system which consisted of MBL's driven by Joule-Electra and preferring it, well you can read what he said above. I guess this time arround that inner voice was right and saved me some aggravation as I would not have been too happy if I gotten the results you made reference to above.

I have not ruled them out 100% as of yet but now I know prior to laying out any money I'm gonna have to listen first, I'm going to be patient this time arround. I look forward to your thoughts, too bad you were not a little closer.

My understanding and past experience from using other class "D" amps is it really takes "many many" hours to break-in and you need to be very patient. Steve I heard you are suppose to being getting more of that white stuff too tomorrow, so far my grass is still green here.

Radicalsteve, I was mistaken when I said refer to above Dob's thread. It was actually on another thread titled,

"D" amps, general discussion who's 1 and why?

Read below I just copied and pasted what Dob had to say about his most recent listening experience;

"I am not sure if you mean my review where I compared Spectron (positively) with VTL Sigfrieds but if its true I heard other tube amplifiers since."

"While, I will not take a "penny" from Spectron - its good amp, there are few OTL amplifiers which lead you directly to heaven."

"I spent a week in Canada and friend of the friend owns Joule-Electra Rite of Passage and big MBL speakers. I spent a large number of hours , almost every day, in his listening room. I will not tell you how accurate was this or inacuracte was that (I am professional cellist) - frankly I did not give a ... I knew I can't stand, I can't leave, I can't stop listening to the music. It was increadibly REALISTIC representation of REAL music. I am like a dog - I can tell you what I hear, I can't explain why (I did not hear euphonic even order or other kind of distortions, sorry)"

"Joule-Electra's web site is a bit neglected so you have to do your own research..... and you will discover that his "equipment" was reviewed time and time again by Harry Pearson of TAS, David Robonson of Positive Feedback and such, that he has many prestigeous awards etc etc."

"So at first I thought that I am insane but now I know that I am only poor. I can't afford big MBL with Rite of Psssage."

"I suspect that you want to say that I was hearing effect of MBL. Its true but I heard to these great speakers with so many solid state amps (including MBL) that I know that I heard - I heard "magic" pure and simple "magic"."

Don't want to go off topic, but last night I got the MONOBLOCK MIII's up and running with my tubed SF Line 3. I am sure there is a lot of settling down to take place as I have also had to add new Y-cables and different speaker connections and a new power cord set up BUT first impressions are WOW. Big difference in width of soundstage and uncanny spatial location of instruments - it sounded like a the guitar player was sitting on a stool tight on the left hand corner of the stage! Very holographic. Musically I noticed more flow and pace, maybe better definition or detail, but that was just the first take. More to follow, possibly under a more appropriate thread.

Radicalsteve, I have to say I'm a bit confused with your most recent threads regarding Spectron and ARC REF3 pre combo saying "As to the Ref 3 I am assuming it is purely an impedance miss-match or such."

I found a thread of yours posted on 04-18-08 that said;

Title was Spectron Musician 3 First Impressions?

"The Spectron is a good match with my ARC Ref3; it runs ridiculously cool, no noise, total control top to bottom, but it is not lush, it does not color the signal and it is remarkably effortless driving my Apogees, very quiet driving my Raven/Focal hand-built MTM's. If I had to sum up so far, it has poise, clarity, definition and gives a confidence that it delivers the most musical response from whatever you feed into it. Just be aware that it will highlight any deficiencies in your system or your room acoustics."

and there was no such mention of this and then I read on 11-30-08 in this thread where you say you replaced the Audio Research Ref3 because it was sounding "very bright and hard." while paired up with the Spectron's.

I now read your latest thread today you saying;

"I have also had to add new Y-cables and different speaker connections and a new power cord set up"

Radicalsteve, I was trying to get a feel for your system consisted of especially due to the fact you having a REF3 pre which I currently have and had asked what it consisted of a couple of times but didn't get a reply back so I did some reading of your past threads and found you are using Apogee Stages, Raven/Focal hand-built MTM's.

I received a couple of personal emails saying they own the AR REF3 paired up these same Spectron amps and the sound they are getting is not "very bright or hard" as you put it.

Can you clarify, thanks.

Dev, I will try to be succinct. The Spectron is a very revealing amp; my first one replaced tube Sonic Frontier Power 3's and the increased clarity was obvious from day 1. Over about 500 hours the amp settled in to become clear, open, coherent and presentation was the most lucid I have heard in my system. As time went on I found that as the Spectron opened up, there were was a degree of stridency I was previously unaware of in combination with the REF 3.

During this time I did change my speakers as well to another self-built design based on the GR Research OBI 7's, which are dipoles and also extremely transparent and lively. When I exchanged the REF 3 for my Line 3 (I owned both at the same time) I was able to compare directly and the difference was immediately obvious and I could not go back to the REF 3 without feeling it was edgy, brittle etc in comparison to the Line 3 which has always been a great controlled neutral pre and suddenly the Line 3 becomes really alive and the REF 3 is over the top for me in my system.

I truly believe the REF 3 IS A WORLD CLASS PREAMP, but as the Spectron found its groove, the REF 3 seemed out of place. I now believe my Line 3 has a much better match as the music just flows - not a highly quantitative assessment I agree, but emotionally I have a clear preference. Since the REF 3 goes for 2 X the $ of the Line 3, I sold it. Based on my experience I would tend to recommend a preamp for the Spectron that is "smooth and neutral"" (whatever that means) versus one that is forward and bold. The ARC house sound has not shifted that much over the years and there are many comments here on that - BTW, I am still a big fan. I know Simon likes the BAT gear to with the Spectron and now I see (hear) why. If I was looking at SS, based on my limited experience I would choose a Sim Audio P7 or P8 rather than a Classe for example. I hope you get the drift.

So much depends on other system components it really is hard to compare. I tend to use silver IC cables for example because I favor an open transparent, energetic sound, rather than a bloomy, softer sound. Most of all I value coherence and tonality and I don't like a smeared or distorted sound such as SE Triodes - that should trigger a couple of flames!

As to changing PC's and speaker cabling etc; that is inevitable when you go from stereo to a monoblock configuration as I have just done. I should add that in the stereo mode I used the remote sense cables, no idea if that had any impact on the REF 3 presentation.

Steve