Power Amps with High Current or High Damping

Whatever is going on here, damping factor (which is over-rated) has little to do with it. The speaker has a moderate impedance without a lot of phase shift- a tube amplifier as commented in the reviews can work with it just fine. In fact you don't need a lot of 'current'- you simply need the power to make it play since an 89 db efficiency is going to need some power behind it to make it play to convincing volume in a moderate (say 17'x25' room), depending on the program material.

So there is some difference between the two amps first mentioned that is not stated in the specs. It could be something as simple as reacting differently to the same speaker cable, which was not changed, at least so far as we know.

Hi Krell_man, this is a bit off the amp topic but I wanted to respond to your thread regarding the Wadia 581 SE vs "Accustic Arts" mainly because I was all excited after reading your thread.

So I contacted my friend and made a trip over to his place last nite for a listen.

He uses a pre now but originally had the Wadia connected direct to the amps as you currently do. He has Bryston 7 SST's mono's and Thiel 3.7's, he uses Elrod power cables.

1. My observation without getting into detail was the same as his, you really need a pre with this unit and that is why in the end he got one. The sound just does not compare without one.

2. I borrowed the unit, I hooked it up direct in my system. I then hooked it up with my pre. which in my opinion was much better but sorry it still does not compare to my current set-up, not even close.

I was all excited about this but in the end there was nothing I liked better period, if I had I would have commented. I fully understand your comments and reference made to the "AA" dac and transport you had, I fully understand the price difference with my current set-up also but honestly only one listen and the comparison conveys money well spent on my part.

My friend is actually going to be getting a 781 latest version to compare so he will let me know if it's worth the drive. My friend also heard my set-up during the comparison and mirrored my conclusions but of course it's allot more $$$$$$$$$.

He asked me to ask you if you can hear your unit running, I could hear his and during quiet passes this distracted me. I was told his first unit was much louder and took it back do to this for an exchange. I hear absolutely nothing with mine even with my ear right up close.

I currently have an Esoteric P01 unit with clock on loan but is just in the process of being broken-in, big! big! dollars and this thing is really noisy compared to mine, I had to put it in anther room as it was distracting me from my listening, what the heck is going on these should be silent.

David,

For some reason, Wadia units take a few days to reach their characteristic sound. This has been commented upon extensively, and it includes everything in their line. I find a cold player to be unlistenable until at least 24 hours. Some claim it takes 7 days. Bottom line is that you should ask your friend to keep it in your system for a week without touching the power or interconnects. It may still not be your thing, but I think it is hard to do a quick A/B comparison.

The Esoteric P01 transport is a real statement piece.

Hi Rob,

thanks for that info. I still have the unit, it was plugged in at 8pm. I did do some initial listening but it was really scary unlistenable and did not mention that. My friend mentioned the unit needed some time, he came by the next day arround 6 pm. for a listen and this is the time frame of our evaluation, so aprox. 22 hours at that time. I'm not trying to suggest that the unit is not good but it just does not compare to my current set-up and the sound comparison of it being on it's own compared to being in the chain with a pre, well the later being by far my preference. I'm not being biased either because I would be the first to admit and would be looking at making changes, even if it was close I would but it's not. The unit is currently still in my system, luckily for me my friend has left it with me as he has gone away until next week. I had the unit playing all day, just back ground music but it's just not in the same league.

This Esoteric is the VU version with 8N copper wire set with clock and yes it's a real statement! never mind the suggest list!!!!!!!!!! Where the heck do I put all these pces. I have to say my expectations will be very high once I do my listening mainly do to the cost factor. I had a Metronome Kalista Ref Transport only in my system but prior to having the Tube dac, what a pce of eye candy. I did prefer it slightly over my Oracle trans but not by much, the deal breaker was that it would not play cds that I have never had issues with in the past nor currently which I factored in along with the list of over $50K compared to $7,500.00.

Have you got your pces back as of yet? waiting to read your thoughts regarding the Karan 1200's.

I'll be the first to say that the Wadia is not for everyone. I've never heard the 581, so I cannot speak to that. For me, an emotional connection with a piece of music requires a system to dig-deep into the recording and present all the information. This includes the musicians technique, the communication between the musicians, subtle alterations in tempo and dynamics, and the space which contains the musician, extending to the stage and the hall. There are CD players that may present a more pleasant or even intoxicating attack and decay of notes, and a more full harmony. The Wadia tells me whether the violinist is playing a Stradiverius, what part of the arms are pressing on the piano keys, how a soloist interacts with the conductor and orchestra in a concerto to create a searing performance. I have over a dozen recordings of Mahler 2, and I like to hear all the differences of each interpretation that go beyond 'a little faster in this movement', 'a little slower in that movement', and 'you can hear the clarinets more in that one'. There are pianists that create beauty from the inside purely from incredible technique, such as Moravec or Bolet. There are also great pianists that have such command of power and phrasing, they make a piece into their own, such as Richter and Horowitz. The Wadia tends to be of the former approach. Perhaps it is a bit more cerebral, but that is what gets me involved whether live or recorded. (BTW, I love Richter and Horowitz and many others, don't get me wrong!)

My DAC is still getting power updates and voltage output rewiring to better match the massive power of the Karans. It should be back together by the end of the month.