Audio Research Ref 5 preamp

I wish I could say that the improvements of the Ref5 are slight versus the Ref3, but IMHO they are not.
The Ref 5 has lower noise and higher resolution, but also handles dynamics in a more musical way.
I have measured the noise and distortion spectrum of the Ref5 and both broadband noise and mains harmonics are really lower than those of the Ref3.

Obviously there will always be a spectrum of opinion on new models versus what they are replacing. For those pleased with the Ref 3's performance there is little reason to waste time or money considering an upgrade. Who knows, the differences are so striking between the two models that maybe some might prefer the softer and more languid presentation of the 3.

I am taken by surprise however that _anyone_ could ascribe their differences as minor or inconsequential in any top system context. It would be interesting to know more about the system and circumstances of that opinion, but it came as second hand so there's no way to qualify it.

In 25 years of system building and evaluating hundreds of components I've never heard a larger difference between successive models of any component, let alone pre-amps. By comparison, the CD-7 to CD-8 upgrade was minor --though that was a pleasing and worthwhile upgrade. As I stated earlier,in my experience the difference is much closer to the difference one should expect upgrading to more powerful, refined twice-the-price amps in a system with slightly inefficient speakers.

Hi guys, this dealer is one of the first original ARC dealers arround, along with ARC caries all kinds of other gear including Jeff Rowland, Boulder, DCS, Esoteric, JM Labs, Sonus Faber and the list goes on. They have all the toys to play with and to compare and as per my thread above that's what I was told. I have not compared in my own set-up as I have already mentioned but what I will say that I have found in this hobby is that some seem to have to justify their owning and it's a personality thing, for me it's not.

I'm sure the dealer would have liked a sale especially when I was prepared to buy but being a long time client told me what they did so all I can say is I'll find out down the road but as I mentioned in no hurry now.

Dev,

It's great you have a close friend/dealer whom you trust to give advice and there's no reason to think of his opinion as anything but genuine. Knowing some of the circumstances and context for that opinion would be enlightening but no one expects you to share all of that. It's just fwiw.

>>>"I will say that I have found in this hobby is that some seem to have to justify their owning and it's a personality thing,"<<<

Ok, there's no need to belittle anyone's opinion that differs with your dealer.

Everyone has a right to share a first hand opinion here based on experience without you questioning whether it is based on ego or purchase justification.

Using the "My dealer told me..." reasoning makes sense as an excuse to defer or delay your own trial of any product, no quibbles there.

However, using his comments as evidence that anyone who experienced it differently is over-stating their experience or has some furtive motive for doing so is whacked.

Like I said, good for you. Within whatever context your dealer tested the pre-amp in I am sure he was entirely truthful and reported his impressions accurately.

I've said and written this many times. People using different systems, different rooms, various ancillaries and frame of reference can come to different conclusions about a piece of gear and BOTH can be spot on accurate. Or am I over-stating that subjective reality?

The fact that your dealer told you the differences were minor should in NO WAY have you inferring that mine or anyone else's reported experience is not genuinely derived. My system context was explained from soup to nuts as were my impressions and full context. I took care to make sure my comments were accurate and carefully qualified.

Having you drop in with a "dealer friend" who disagrees is no problem and is in fact interesting to know( if there were more context). However, the misplaced bard about people posting positive experiences or reviews of the Ref 5 because they are justifying purchases or on some ego trip is crap.

If you believe that is true in this case, bring more than "a dealer told me..." as your evidence that someone else is being disingenuous.

Samuel,

I can see you are one of those types I mentioned by your response above, take it easy. I never attacked anyone's opinion and enjoyed reading your review but provided another version in which you seem to have a problem with and that tells me allot.

As I mentioned when I get arround to it I'll get one and have a listen within my own set-up but I'm in no hurry now. Just to let you know I had a listen with the Ref5 in a system that I have heard a few times prior and this time arround it didn't have my jaw dropping saying, wow! this pre has just changed everything I gotta have it. I referred to the dealer saying, is it just me but I don't notice much of a difference from when the Ref3 was hooked-up and that's when the comment came about.

I would rather wait and hear it within my own set-up to hear if there really is all that much of a difference as a couple of you point out to justify the cash upgrade difference but others are also allowed to provide info. right without being attacked.