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Preamp for Thiel 1.6's

Would like recommendations on a preamp for Thiel 1.6's. Also have Rotel 1095 power amp. Currently using a Pioneer 94 Receiver as a preamp, which works OK, but I suspect is the weakest link in the system. Thanks for your ideas.
128x128geh7
unsound
7,341 posts
 
FWIW, despite lost of dealers pushing them, I've never cared for the Rotels with Thiels. IMHO, there are much better choices for not too much more money. YMMV. I do think most speakers and the especially Thiels benefit from a quality amplifier more so than a preamp. The tube pre suggestion might be a good one, so long as it works well with your preferred amp.
sufentanil's avatar
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sufentanil
782 posts
 
The best combination with Thiels I've heard yet is a Plinius preamp / amp combo. Of course, that is well beyond your price range but you could easily get a Plinius 8200 integrated amp that might do just the trick.

What is your source? If you're complaining about some harshness with rock, it's possible that this originates at your source components, and that the Thiels are just being ruthlessly revealing (which is generally what they do).

If harshness is your complaint, assuming the source is not to blame, than I agree that a tube preamp might be the way to go. Some of the options at that price range include used Cary, Audio Research, Consonance, Conrad Johnson, Audio Mirror, Quicksilver, Marsh, and too many others to list.

Is there a way that you could, say, borrow a preamp from a dealer to try it in your system and see if that might be a potential solution to your problem, or if the problem lies elsewhere?

Also, I would make sure that you optimize the positioning of your speakers before making any final determinations on the upstream electronics. (Do a search on Google for speaker positioning.)

Michael
tobuns
28 posts
 
I'd agree with Sufentanil, that you should aim for slightly warm side of neutral. I have the 1.6 and IMO, I don't think the Thiel's sound analytical or bright like some people do. I think they just sound extremely transparent. In other words, they sound like the amp that drives them. Put a spectral, or pass, or ayre, or goldmund amp behind them, and they'll present that sound. It's up to you to find the flavor you like.

That is why I'd also agree with Unsound in stating that (for thiels) the amp/speaker combo is more important than the pre / amp combo.

Thiel makes a good product, but they require some system balance. Personally, I think Thiels should be paired with an amp that costs at least as much as the speakers themselves. Some systems work with 50% system budget going to the speakers and 50% at everything else. Some people build very fine sounding systems that way. It just doesn't work with Thiels

That said; you may want to buy a pre with the idea of an amp upgrade in the future. I think the suggestions of Plinus or older Classe are good ones. I might also add Sim Audio or maybe VTL (if you want a tube)
cmalak
681 posts
 
Personally, I think Thiels should be paired with an amp that costs at least as much as the speakers themselves. Some systems work with 50% system budget going to the speakers and 50% at everything else. Some people build very fine sounding systems that way. It just doesn't work with Thiels

I own Thiel 2.4s and my amplification (ARC pre and amp) are 4X the price of the Thiels and the 2.4s keep up very nicely. Tobuns is exactly right. Thiels are very transparent and require high quality amplification. I think the Rotel 1095/Thiel 1.6 combo may sound a bit lean or to some analytical. What i would do is put the Rotel up for sale and add the proceeds to your $2K budget and buy a used Pathos Logos integrated amp. It's a hybrid tube/ss amp that puts out 110 wpc into 8ohm and 220 wpc into 4 ohms. That amp is very musical and I think will make a great match with the Thiel 1.6s. If you have a Pathos dealer near you try to audition it (preferably with your speakers). It's a wonderful amp and should have more than enough juice to drive your 1.6s with ease. Plus the one box solution will help you save on a set of ICs as well. My 2c worth.
tom_hankins
928 posts
 
When I used the Thiels with krell amps. The BAT preamps added a some warmth and alot of body that was missing.
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