Preamp or Not

Anticipating the sonic results of driving amps direct with a CDP/DAC is really a crap shoot I think. I have a Wadia 302CDP. It is not bright tonally speaking but so far with the amps I have connected it to the tone was clinical and it benefited from using it with preamps (I've used several different preamps and the Wadia always benefited.) Perhaps it needed the edges filed off a tad by a pre-amp. I wanted it to be otherwise, but not to be so. I think if you must have balanced channels and/or XLR connectors, and your fussy about tone, you're going to need to get a pre-amp. Too bad you can't get demo on a CPD that you might favor. Actually, if you could figure out which CDP you would like, performance wise, you could buy one. Then if it didn't work you could add the appropriate pre-amp to solve your problem. FWIW.

Thank you Newbee, 4est and all others with comments. I guess if preamp was not necessary for sound quality, everyone would use a CDP with volume control. I have a couple of decent preamps but both introduce distortion when connected to the amps. I think my distortion problem started when I sold a pair of very good gold and silver RCA interconnects. I am not sure if I had the noise before and didn't notice it or the cables I am using now are not as good. A passive preamp may do the trick as has been mentioned before, but I don't want to buy a bunch of new equipment and still have the distortion noise. So that's why I am asking members to provide me with their experience. So far I have learned a lot. I would appreciate any info on "ground loop", etc. It may be very obvious to most but I am in the dark when it comes to complex trubleshooting. Keep those great comments coming.

There are electrical reasons which make a preamp the better choice for most amps out there. I will try to elaborate some other time. However for your cable question, it is worth trying xlrs to see what is going on. It sounds more likely, however, that your preamp is either introducing or amplifying a noise that is already there (rather than the noise being picked up by your cables.) Maybe try the preamp with other amps to see if it makes a difference. If the amp has gain control drop it and see if that helps. It is of course possible that if you are running very long rcas they pick up noise but that would have to be fairly long cable runs...

I have tried passive before and it does sound clear but thin in most cases. XLR was developed to reduce noise in very long runs of cables for bands. It works very well ask any band member of any clout if they use RCA and they will chuckle. I have a BAT VK51SE preamp and I have to say it is VERY quiet! The RCA cable was originally designed for tone arm connections (short lengths). I have had single ended cables and XLR both and I must say balanced is DEAD Silent. You can see my system and see that I am VERY serious about the sound. You can turn on the system and turn the volume to max without the cd playing of course and barley hear audible hiss from JM LAB Utopia tweeter at about two inches to my ear.

Thank you for great comments.

Mihalis, As far as changing amps and preapms, I have done all that with no positive results. My interconnect runs are less than a foot so the length can't be an issue. Nither of my preamps have external gain control.

Booboobaer, I am glad you confirmed that it is possible to hear no noise from you speakers at maximum output with no source. I was begining to think this is a normal anomaly. I have tried various speakers as well and the noise is still there. since there is no noise from the amp with no connection to the pre. the problem is isolated to the pre unless there are other factors involved. My system sounds very good, at least to my ears, but it's one of those thing that you want to find a reason for and ultimately a solution. The only reason I have not yet decided on a new tubed amp and XLR connection, is that I have no reasonable degree of assurance that after spending another several $K, I will eliminate distortaion. Since I have tried multiple amps, preamps, speakers, power cords, wall socket, etc. without any result, I am in a dilemma to purchase another piece of equipment. So I am hoping one of the members with the same problem can help. All comments are very valuable and I welcome all. Thank You