Why is the market for used Levinson amps so slow?

Lots of what I just read in this thread is old horror stories, some are even true. Harman has shuffled things around more than once in the last several years.

But Levinson Lexicon Proceed service stabilized years ago after High Tech Masters was let go. Turn around is reasonable if not good and we can make the equipment more reliable than ever.

For example some of the No33 were known to have buzz in the speakers. We now know the massive transormers leak enough flux to be audible in a speaker NOT connected to the 33. just loop the speaker wire around the 33. similarly you can loop your wires around the the 33 and cancel the internal buzz picked up. NO BUZZ

just contact us for more information and support.
Pyramid Audio or The Service Bench

Wow, did catch this lively thread until now. I guess people will believe whatever they want to believe.

I personally experienced the Levinson nightmare three times a few years back, and have documented my experiences in detail here back then.

There were two core issues:

1/ Reliability with the 33X series amplifiers: The caps were known to break down. The ML tech I spoke with confessed that it had to do with both design and reliability of supplied capacitors from the original supplier. My #333 had been "recapped" 3 times. Twice by me, and once by the dealer before I bought it. (Found that out through the service log from the service tech). I had to pay out of pocket for the third replacement. Less than a year after my last repair, ML issued a note internally regarding the capacitor failures and extended the warranties on capacitors for 5 additional years.(Basically free of charge for any capacitor failure on 33X amps.)

Again, the issue is with the 33X series only. I have not heard of any issues with the 33, 33H, or any other models.

2/ Shady service practice: As pointed out earlier, you were required to pay a high charge in advance before ML would issue a RMA. Both my amp (#333), and transport (#37) went into service a week apart. The tray on my transport was not closing properly. The tech assured me on the phone that it just required some calibration and would not reach the maximum amount. At the end, I received the max bill on both the transport ($1,400+/-) and amp($1,100+/-) after the fact even though I had requested that they notify me before fixing anything. They cited that they had to replace my entire transport mechanism and upgrade the software. Few months later, while talking to another audiophile, I found out that ML had issued a technical bulletin to all the dealers indicating the fix for this issue a few years back - a push of few buttons on the faceplate to initiate recalibrate. He had also pulled the notification from the internet and sent to me.

I've since traded my amp for a Pass X3505. I still have the #36 and #37 in my second system. I've written the company off ever since that experience. Spending that kind of money ($10k in the late 90s) to get a faulty design/built amp certainly is unacceptable. But what really pissed me off was the shady service practice. Maybe they have improved since, but ML would need to do a lot to convince most of us ex-owners to go back to their product.

FrankC

Glai,

Ken was over the first week that I received my X350.5 (brand new) from the dealer. I told him that it wasn't even burnt-in yet. But he took a listen, went back and put his 432 on sale. A week later, he had a X350.5 in his living room.

Performance-wise, we all preferred the X350.5 driving his Dynaudio C-4 over the ML432.

The reliability issue was only with the 33X series (331-336). I have not heard of any issues with the 400 and the 500 series.

Changing amps again?

FrankC

i would (briefly) like to sum up a few issues regarding Mark Levinson amplifiers and i base this on my own personal experiences as well-
1. industry leader in amazing-sounding solid state. Huge pride of ownership (at least for me).
2. owned a 23.5 stereo amp that made some of the sweetest music i have ever heard in my home. beautiful, compact, elegant, superb bass, a true dual-monoraul design.
3. my next experience was with a pair of 33H mono blocks. they were nothing less than amazing sounding- DYNAMICS! TRANSPARENCY. EFFORTLESS,
one day one channel went out on me. the repair was quite expensive but the authorized service (Pyramid) was very thorough and explained what had gone wrong in detail. the shipping was also horribly expensive, too. but in the end it was still worth it. the amps did wonderful things (they Sang) through Egglestons, and then Von Schweikert speakers.
4. other levinson pieces included transports, DACS, CDP's, all performed great.
there was an incident involving the #37 transport which was unreasonably expensive to repair and i was just as upset about it as everyone else. i know these transports had a limited life-span and created a lot of negative press, but they also happened to sound really good. At the same time, other manufacturers' players also developed problems- they just didn't have the higher-than-normal expectations that the ML brand generated.
the company has undergone ownership changes and those incredibly-high expectations have suffered, but once again it's still a pretty esoteric brand. and the clean aesthetics they still insist on (instead of worthless/even silly gimmicks) have my enduring respect. and they still have a lot of product categories to re-introduce (such as an internet-ready DAC, or an Integrated Amplifier, a new Phono Stage, etc.)
unfortunately (as M.Fremer recently discovered reviewing the Dartzeel Monoblocks)
NOBODY is perfect. i can't imagine what i would do if something like that happened to me (i won't be spending that insane amount of money anyway- $72,000/channel?). i thought that sort of thing only happened with tubes. It's nice to know he thought they sounded good, though..