Can a new amplifier affect speaker placement?


Hi all,

So I went out and got me a shiny new amp. One thing I'm certain I've noticed is the bass isn't as rich as with the old amp. The new amp is well-known for its bass response. The old one may have been too (don't remember) - but it's less than half the power and a fourth the cost of the new one. Both amps are overachievers in their price category. In short - I've trouble believing my little Creek 5350SE has bigger bass than my NAD M2. I wonder if something else is going on. Has anyone had to re-position their speakers, following a new amp purchase?
sturgl
The issue might be related to the nature of amp. The NAD is a digital amp, which I believe is called a class "D". The Creek is a hi-current type, probably "AB". From what I've been reading digital amps can be a bit thin sounding. Some of the positive points about "D" types are little to no heat and low electric consumption. The NAD might not be the best amp for you at this time. NAD makes more convention designed amps that are well reguarded too. You might want to look into one of those if you're looking exclusively for that brand - good luck.
Another way of viewing the problem: your new amp may be "showing" you that your speakers weren't optimally to begin with.

As Philjolet rightly points out, this is part of the fun!
How long have you had the amp? You need a good 100-200 hours of burn in before making any critical decisions. As stated synergy is a big factor the other amp could of had beefier or bloated mid bass which your speakers may be more sensitive to whereas the new amp may be tighter and deeper reaching which your speakers don't duplicate as much. every speaker placement formula i have seen is based on room size and response not the equipment itself. Moving a tad closer to the wall or a corner can beef up bass but this is usually associated with a unnatural bloat or bloom that is typically not desired. U can also try a power cord thats known for bass response in amps, tho my experience with power cords is that it makes a huge dif on some gear and very little on others, depends on design of power supply i guess c if u can borrow one.
Well, Stereophile specifications for each amp:

Creek 5350SE: Maximum current: >30A
NAD M2: Maximum output current: >27A

Could this explain what you're hearing? I don't know.

As stated above, what speakers are you using?
Wow - that's a lotta feedback. Thanks, all. Let me start by saying I prefer the M2 in nearly every way over the Creek. While I could still return it, I doubt that I will. The top-end and midrange are noticeably more spacious and detailed. The soundstage is certainly wider (though perhaps not deeper). Transients are much more obvious - you can really hear the pluck of a string with this thing! (sorry) There's more music there, or the pacing's better, or... something - I just want to sit and listen, where I'd find myself getting a little bored with the Creek in the mix. You know what's really cool? Space. In music where there's lots of space (I'm mostly a jazz guy), instruments are set against an utterly black background. I've never heard anything like it, never knew I wanted it, and it's awesome. In short, The M2 addresses many of the "problems" I was hoping to solve in purchasing a new amplifier - and gives me some extras I didn't even know I "needed". I like it - a lot. I just wasn't expecting a perceived bass deficiency, I guess because a) my speakers are pretty sensitive, b) when I heard the amp prior to purchasing, it certainly did not seem bass-shy to me, and c) reviewers had specifically commented on the quality of its bass.

I burned-in the amp for about a hundred hours before paying much attention to its sound - though it may be that it could use more. I'm still running it continuously, so we'll see if the bass opens up some as a result.

I run Pangea power cables for all my equipment. The one I use for my Creek made a huge difference. I never bothered with the stock cable on the NAD. Maybe changing my power cable will help here - hadn't thought of that.

I've had the Creek for quite a few years, and am probably used to its sound. Synergy is the reason I own the speakers I own. When I decided to upgrade from my Totem Acoustics a few years ago, I didn't want to go upgrading my amp as well. I chose the speakers that sounded best to me with the Creek: Paradigm Reference Studio 60v5's. These were not my favorite speakers, but the Aerials I fell in love with lost their magic with the Creek - and I did (and do) really like the Paradigms.

To Mezmo and Winoguy's point, I do kinda think I need to give myself more time to settle in with the M2. FWIW, I spent a LOT of time on speaker placement, chair placement, room treatments, even equipment placement (sidewall!) when I built out my listening room (I'm one of those Jim Smith disciples who believes the room and positioning are exceptionally important factors - and this is where I've spent a healthy amount of resources, while allowing myself to purchase what some might call "budget" equipment (a la Creek and Paradigm), instead of, perhaps, vica verca). So my biases tend to lead me towards fixing problems by optimizing the room first - then looking at everything else.

It's possible the bass coming off the Creek has been a little bloated all along. I "voiced" my (Creek) system using a combination of headphones, room treatments and RTA to get pretty flat in-room response from the Paradigms. BUT I never heard the kind of texture through the Creek that I do through the NAD. The bass is just (seemingly)... bigger through the Creek. It may not be better. Hmmm... could it all be in my head? Could be, could be.

Like Mapman, I'm moving from a Class A to a Class D. More and more, it's sounding to me like I need to let the M2 burn-in some more, sit and listen some more, and then potentially suck it up and go through the whole room optimization process again. I hadn't really anticipated that, but like many said, it's part of the "fun" right? Then perhaps start looking at my cables. Then possibly optimize again. Rinse, repeat!

Thanks everyone.