Phono Preamp Gain Question


I am looking to upgrade my phono preamp as I have just acquired a much better cartridge. The cartridge has an output of .28mv; my tube preamp has gain of 12db. What is the lowest gain that a moving coil stage of a phono preamp should have for me to listen without excessive noise? I listen at realistic levels--medium to loud. I have read that some of the newer phono preamps without transformers--ARC PH6 or CJ TEA2se to name two, will not have enough gain for my application. Thanks in advance for your help.
teeshot
Gain is in a way a chain, even from Preamp to Amp is important or how easy your amps can drive your speakers... but generally a Phono Stage with 58-64dB will be right.
Don't be fooled from excessive high Phono gain, most do not sound good at a level of >70dB, good Phonostage Design is a real task, even today.
I'm using a 0.28 mV cartridge too, 60 db of gain in the phono stage, 20 db of gain in the line stage is MORE than enough for my system. I wouldn't recommend less than 56 db of gain for you.
I would say you need at least 60db. 66db would be better. It really depends on how quiet the phono stage is. If it claims to have 70db gain but has a high noise floor then you can't really use that 70db. It is very difficult to get high gain and low noise at the same time. It's even more difficult to have both and good sound as well.
Good comments by the others. Seconding Sarcher's comment, attempting to define "the lowest gain that a moving coil stage of a phono preamp should have" for a particular cartridge is risky, because different phono stages that provide the same amount of gain can differ widely in how much noise they generate in doing so. Also, comparing signal-to-noise ratio numbers for different phono stages is often an exercise in futility, because S/N specs are not consistently defined in terms of reference levels, and in terms of whether and how they are "weighted".

Also, the sensitivity of your power amplifier (the input voltage that is required to drive it to full power) is a factor to consider. If it has particularly low sensitivity, meaning a high sensitivity number, if the sum of the phono stage and line stage gains are too low you may not be able to drive the amp to full power even with the volume control at max.

My suggestion is simply that after coming up with a preliminary list of candidates, try to determine if others have used each of them successfully with the particular cartridge, or at least with similarly specified cartridges.

Regards,
-- Al
I agree that a phono gain of 56 to 65 or so should be just fine. My setup is pretty similar to yours in terms of gain. My MCs range from .25 to .35mv and my line stage has 15db gain. My power amps span low to high sensitivity, and my speakers range from 90 to 97db. I find a total phono gain (including MC step up) of mid-50's to mid-60's to be just right.