Why will no other turntable beat the EMT 927?


Having owned many good turntables in my audiophile life I am still wondering why not one of the modern designs of the last 20 years is able to beat the sound qualities of an EMT 927.
New designs may offer some advantages like multiple armboards, more than one motor or additional vibration measurements etc. but regarding the sound quality the EMT is unbeatable!
What is the real reason behind this as the machine is nearly 60 years old, including the pre-versions like the R-80?
thuchan
Peter, agree! In the beginning of the thread Tbg stated "its now all said in the thread" .How wrong one can be :-)

Dkarmeli, I have both platters, currently using the glass platter which is not made of pure glass, coming with a special rubber layer on top.
I agree completely with you on the difference in sound of the 927 and the MS 8000, couldn`t describe it better.

Regarding the Continuum I have a different opinion than most show session results would lead to. My Criterion running with a Cobra arm and the Goldfinger v2 is a serious contender to the previous mentioned ones. Especially when matched with a perfect aligned Boulder 2008 phono stage (not easy to configurate this machine precisely).
Peterayer, please bear with me with some background before I get to answering your questions, I feel that its an important part of this conversation.

Nothing is perfect and judging any piece of equipment is always in the context of a system that has many variables including the stands, quality of mains and listening space. I know that I haven't addressed all the issues in my music chain so everything in that context. What I have done is move around a lot and tried enough different components in my own systems or those of my clients and friends to know what my music chain is or isn't doing right. My own two main systems have remained more or less the same for the past 10+ years so I'm very familiar with it. So always keep this in mind when people comment on equipment. its never in isolation. But there are certain characteristics that one can pick up if they know what to look for.

I have my standard reference arm/cartridge combination and almost the tables I refer to always have this arm/cartridge combination set up as standard. Unless provided by manufacturer, they all sit on massive vibraplane type lab tables but I don't use air with any of them.

The reference tables mentioned in my threads all perform at exceptionally high levels and don't sonically suffer in any obvious way, I really can't find any weaknesses in them. They don't have what a lot of people call vinyl sound. There's no thickness or ripeness like a Linn nor is it thin hyper detail sound ala Clearaudio, they're very neutral and balanced. Many listeners have expectation of overt character when it comes to lps and are initially thrown off by the neutrality of these players and even more surprising is the actual lp that has no "vinyl sound" like we always thought was there growing up with mass market systems. It takes them some time to get beyond that expectation. This is apart from the analogue vs digital conversation.

To your questions on the EMT 927, I don't hear any shortcomings that I can't attribute to other parts of my system. They're there with every source that I listen to including digital. I love the ergonomics of this table, its just joy to set up and use. For me 927's most unique sonic quality is what I mentioned above. Its the solidity with density and the way it brings forward the space and ambience of the recording. I'm not a reviewer and apologize for not having the vocabulary to express this in audiophile terminology. its not about bass, mids, highs, etc., or anything in isolation, its the total presentation that is very natural and real. That's the best compliment I can give any product. The American Sound has many of the same qualities and perhaps slightly more detailed sound.

Obviously I've only listened to a fraction of what's out there under controlled conditions. Mostly its been the mega buck unobtaniums that I have experience with. On the sane price level I like TW acoustics tables, very little to complain about, they sound excellent and considering the ridiculousness of high end audio these days are relatively good value . Given the availability of 301/401 Garrards and companies like Loricraft or Artisan Fidelity who refurbish and supply very good plinths, they can be considered current production and I highly recommend them. Again, aside from the excellent sound quality they offer value in today's market. I can recommend Loricraft's 501 as an excellent modern day idler, haven't heard Mosin's beauty but its on my radar and to try list. At the stupidly expensive end, I like the Vinci and of course the AirForce One, the upcoming, less expensive AirForce Two should be interesting too. Disclaimer, as a dealer I have vested interest in the AirForce tables.
Thuchan, I have both platters too but I ended up using the original felt platter. The glass platter seems more detailed, I don't think that it really is though but its also somewhat harder sounding than the felt platter. Initially I thought that the felt platter was wooly compared to the glass one but then I realized that its musically more homogenous so I went back to it. Of course the choice is a matter of the reproduction chain and personal preference.

Do you mind if I ask what you have for the rest of your system?
Dear Thuchan, Can you elaborate on the necessity to "align" the Boulder 2008? I have never heard that term applied to a phono stage. Thanks.
Dkarmeli,
I got my R 80 with the glass platter and went then for the felt platter because a friend of mine exactely described what you realized.

my system is a very humble one: ARC 40 preamp and EMT JPA66 preamp (also phono), Wavac HE 833 II amps, Bavarian Voice speakers (5 way horn system plus Subs, TAD drivers and SupraVox fieldcoil). different tables, phono pres (Zanden, Boulder, Kondo, EMT), SUTs (also WE618) and all what you need to put into arms ...

on digital dCS, Accuphase, Wadia and Esoteric.
When I returned from Tokyo I realised a dream I always had, building a listening room. Maybe this project became more important for me than single audio units - the planning phase took me on a two years trip and I learned a lot about room acoustics.