2. amps-preamps
  3. 131720-103887

Amp recommendation and setup advice please

Hello,

I love music and I adore quality sound - I cannot listen to music on ordinary speakers/devices.

I have been trying to do my research on sound systems/speakers/amps etc.. and learn/understand the whole shebang, but I'm not that much of a tech head. 

I want to buy the Klipsch RF-7 II tower speakers (I think they are passive, hence requiring an amp). 

I want them for both my new TV and also the vinyl/turntable setup I am going for, which is as follows:

Turntable - ProJect Debut Carbon Premium with Ortofon 2M RED (cartridge)
Phono (pre-amp) - ProJect Phono Box DS
Speakers - as above
Subwoofer - thinking either Klipsch R-12SW or R112SW
Amp - ??

I have a few questions:

1. Am I on the right tracks for having all the essentials?
2. Can someone recommend a good amp to power my speakers and sub please, and does the sub need powering or does it have it's own amp? 
3. Do I need a DAC for TV and connection to laptop? If so can you recommend a good one please? I was thinking of Audioengine D1 Premium 24 bit DAC Interface Connector.
4. Please suggest any alternative products if any of the stuff I mentioned are no good or don't fit together that well.
5. How would I set all of this up? Do I need anything else?
6. Do I need more speakers? I'm worried that the sub may be too much bass and drown out the tower speakers. 

I apologise for my lack of knowledge - I've just signed up here because I read that I could get advice and guidance from enthusiasts and experts. I know that my questions and post may frustrate some of you as I may have made some rookie mistakes, and perhaps this type of post has been done a 100 or so times but wasn't sure how to get answers/help. 

Many kind thanks in advance!

Mo
laher
auxinput
2,920 posts
 

Oh, mesch might have been recommending the Yamaha integrated for your TV system.  So, looking at this:

Yamaha 801 + ELAC B6 bookshelves

Audio GD NFB--11.28 + Emotiva Airmotiv 5s powered monitors

The Yamaha/ELAC combination will have the ability to connect many analog sources as well as several digital sources.  Plus have the ability to connect a subwoofer if you choose.

The Audio-GD/Emotiva combination will have superior sound quality.  However, only 3 digital inputs (one COAX, one Toslink, one USB).

Cost will be somewhat similar.

mesch
3,529 posts
 
Auxinput has been very generous in his provision of extensive and excellent advice. Most certainly the Parasound Halo is better built than the Yamaha at 2.5 times the price. 

My recommendations were to pertain to the music system as I would prefer to spend most of my dollars there. I don't believe in spending to much to augment the TV experience. For that I would purchase a used AVR and set up a LRC 3 channel system.

I recommended the Yamaha as it is a quality product that, was within budget (as I understood it), and it made for a simpler system, having a DAC, phonostage likely as good as the Project that was proposed, and has the possibility of adding a subwoofer. 

Laher, could you please provide a better read on your budget for the two systems? 
laher OP
38 posts
 
Okay seems we are getting somewhere :)

For my father's TV setup it can look something like this:
- Emotiva AirMotive 5s (powered speakers, i.e. built in amp)
- HT processor (Krell Showcase or B&K Ref 20) OR 2 channel preamp/DAC (Audio-GD NFB-11.28)
-  configure satellite receiver to output 2-channel stereo audio through the digital connection and get a Blue Jean Cable Beldon 1694A 6 foot digital cable to connect them

Questions: do I need a preamp for powered speakers? do the HT processors you suggested have built in DAC and/or preamp? 

---

For my vinyl setup it can look something like this:

- tower speakers (passive, make and model TBD)
- integrated amp such as Parasound Halo (phono preamp, preamp, amp, DAC) OR integrated amp (one that does not have DAC) + external DAC ( Gustard X20 pro or LKS MH-DA004)
- turntable (still thinking about the ProJect Debut Carbon Premium with Ortofon 2M RED cartridge)

Questions: do I need to consider anything else in this setup? what type of cables do I use? If I do go with the external DAC, please suggest a better integrated amp (as you mentioned). If this doesn't include phone preamp then I could consider the  PS Audio Nuwave phono preamp, but perhaps it's better to have an integrated amp that does include this and just have the external DAC, what do you think? perhaps there are even better integrated amps for the money that don't have phono preamps and then I get both DAC and phono preamps as external. 

---

I totally appreciate your comments about speakers, and I know how difficult it is to give advice without a foundation to build upon. I live in the UK and just moved to a new city and I have not been able to find a decent hi-fi store, they all seem to be commercial shops that sell the standard sony, panasonic, samsung type speakers that non audiophiles will buy. 

I'm not sure if this helps but my vinyls are mainly jazz, blues, soul, but if and when I do plug in iPod/iPhone or laptop then I will play music with more bass and more of a punch like hip hop, house, rock, RnB. 

Thanks Mesch for the consideration against my original mentioned product for the same budget, it's good to know that I have a good option (Yamaha 801) for around that price bracket. And I agree in not spending too much on the TV setup, my father isn't that interested in having the best, but I will also be watching and listening on this setup so I'd like it to be decent enough. 

I guess to answer everyone's question about budget (which is difficult because I hadn't really considered it and set any limit):

For the TV setup - maybe betwen $1000-1,500 but of course if it's possible to go lower than great.
For Vinyl setup - anywhere between $3000-5000 but this is for me to so willing to go higher as necessary. 

If it helps in providing amp recommendations, I don't think I'll want to add a sub to the TV setup but may want to on my vinyl setup but earlier comments said that with the right amp and setup, the types of tower speakers I was considering will have enough bass, so this is fine for me. So it's not an essential to have that option for my vinyl setup. 

Thanks again all for your knowledgeable expertise and insights and for your patience with me as a newbie. 
mesch
3,529 posts
 
Your budget is greater than I anticipated.

Though I certainly understand the interest in powered speakers, I prefer ownership of a separate amplifier and speakers. This allows one greater flexibility to change out speakers. Given this preference, for the TV system I would consider the purchase of an integrated amplifier w/DAC and a set of speakers. I also am more inclined to use a subwoofer with video than with audio. As a FYI, there is a Yamaha A-801S amplifier being offered here on AG. Not trying to push you in that direction, just believe it to be one quality full service integrated for your budget. There are others.

Regarding a vinyl/digital based system with emphasis toward vinyl, within a $5000 budget, it might serve you to start a separate thread asking for advice for the turntable/arm/cartridge for such a system. One could easily be justified in placing the same budget towards the TT as the speakers in such a system.

I would strongly consider searching the used market for speakers as well as an integrated amp, DAC, and phonostage however packaged. Your speaker choice will establish the need for amplification power. Stay away from speakers that are hard to drive. Seek out quality over quantity power.  
auxinput
2,920 posts
 

Wow, you’re in UK?  That does make things a lot more difficult because most sellers in USA will not ship to UK.

 

Okay for your TV setup, I would nix the idea of an HT Processor because it is going to be hard to find something that can ship to you within your budget.  So:

- Emotiva AirMotiv 5s - $499 USD (check with Emotiva to see if they will ship this to UK)

- Audio-GD NFB-11.28 $330 USD plus shipping (they will ship to UK)

 

Alternatively, you could move up the DAC/preamp to an Audio-GD NFB-29.28.  It is twice as much at $638 USD.  However, it is a better DAC/preamp and it also has more inputs (for both analog and digital), just in case you need to expand.  It depends if you want to spend the extra money. 

Or you could do like mesch says and get a very low-cost integrated with some ELAC B6 speakers.

In addition, you will also need that digital cable (Blue Jean Beldon) and a set of RCA audio cables that are long enough to reach the AirMotivs (maybe something like 6 feet?).  You can start with cheap cables initial if you want.  Or buy something like the Audioquest solid-core interconnects.

-----

Regarding your vinyl/dac system, the challenge here is that the availability/shipping AND the UK exchange rate is going to kill you.  For local stuff, you can try looking on the Ebay “UK” site (https://www.ebay.co.uk/).  I see several integrated amps from Ebay “UK” that I would put on a list:

 

HEGEL H200 Integrated Amplifier USED - £1,499.00 / $1,969 USD. This is only an integrated amp with no additional phono or DAC.  It is the most powerful of this short list and the Hegel is known to be very refined sounding.  The Hegel will likely be the best out of this list, but you would have to buy both an external DAC and phono preamp.

 

Parasound Halo Stereo Integrated Amplifier DEMO - £2,195.00 / $2,884 USD.  This has everything built into it already.  Parasound is known to have a lot of punch/slam (maybe even more than Hegel?).  It’s a great starter platform, but you can always expand/improve by adding external DAC or phono preamp.  This DEMO on Ebay UK is actually more than USD Retail, so if you were interested in this one, I would just buy a new one from Audio Advisor in the USA (they will ship to UK as long as they ship to your credit card address).  It may be hard to find a used one that will ship to UK.

 

- Arcam FMJ A39 Stereo Integrated Amplifier NEW - £1,699.99 / $2,232 USD

- Arcam FMJ A39 Integrated Amplifier USED - £849.00 / $1,115 USD

I included two, one used and one new, so that you can see a range.  The Arcam will be very sweet sounding and easy to listen to (it is biased into Class A to 20 watts, but will output up to 120 watts per channel).  It will not have the slam/punch as the Parasound/Hegel.  This includes a phono preamp.

 

Marantz PM-14S1 Integrated Stereo Amplifier-Gold USED - £1,799.00 / $2,363 USD.  The Marants is voiced to be warm sounding, warm rich.  People love the musicality of it.  The jazz type music does very well on all types of equipment, but since you do like to listen to hip hop / rock / R&B, the Marantz will probably not be fast enough for the punch/slam you want (it will be slower and more laid back).  This includes a phono preamp.

 

Buying an external phono preamp (such as PS Audio Nuwave) or an external DAC (Gustard/LKS) will always sound better than what is included in these integrated amplifiers.  It all depends on your budget.  I would probably lean towards an external DAC because the ability for a DAC to generate a more “analog” sound requires much better equipment.  The DAC included in the Parasound is okay, but nothing extraordinary.

 

I can give you a starting points for speakers (listed on Ebay UK):

New... Monitor Audio Silver 10 3 way 250w floorstanding speakers in Black Oak NEW - £1,150.00 / $1,510 USD.  The Monitor Audio has been known to be a very clean sounding and detailed speaker.  This one has two 8” woofers which will give you good bass punch (as long as you have enough amplifier power).  The C-CAM tweeter is based on ceramic and is very nice.  If you look at other Monitor Audio speakers, it’s important to know that the ribbon type tweeters can sound more laid back (which may not be what you want if you listen to hip-hop / R&B).

Cables are a whole new conversation. Lol.  The opinions will always be all over the board, but in my experience solid-core conductors always win in my tests.  I would avoid anything silver (my own opinion), but rhodium plated are excellent.  If it were me and I was starting out, I would look at the best Audioquest interconnects that still have gold-plated RCA plugs (avoid silver-plated in general).  The Wire World cables that have copper conductors and silver-clad RCA plugs are also very excellent (such as Eclipse 7).

More to discover