Article: "Spin Me Round: Why Vinyl is Better Than Digital"

At the end of the day, you can record an album on digital, and play it back on digital (carefully choosing the equipment), and not be able to tell the two apart. That should tell you that vinyl is nothing but a bunch of colorations and distortions that can be replicated in digital.

I never contested that digital can sound on par with vinyl and even better in SOME case...Assimilating my posts to those who said otherwise is bad faith...

Your post illustrate your total contempt for anyone who express an other position than your false alternative: analog OR digital...Evil or good... Simplistic indeed...

I am not so simple mind sorry. there is other position illustrated by my explanations in my post : Analog and digital are DIFFERENT way for me to access timbre... I dont know which one, analog or digital, is the better in the absolute because perception of timbre naturalness is an acoustical concrete event implying room acoustic and ears/ brain...I myself vouch for digital by the way and all along my posts ... Then you interpret falsely my arguments distorting them because i refuse your childish fixation of an absolute alternative...I refuse to condemn turntable people accusing them of a collective illusion...It is not so simple....

You said that "vinyl is nothing except a bunch of colorations and distortions that can be replicated in digital" then if you were less preoccupied by your ego you would have understood that these colorations pertain to the OBJECTIVE definition of TIMBRE and to his SUBJECTIVE evaluation by the ears/brain...This is acoustical basic science and my thesis all along against your war against turntables and with your fake alternative pretending to be science....

Digital can mimic analog yes, but it does not means that one is superior to the other, in ALL embeddings room/house, with ANY electronic components... There is too much variable to cut this problem once and for all except like Alexander the Gordian Knot... timbre perception is the crux of the matter and that means EARS differences between people...That means also that some powerful embeddings controls in the 3 audio dimension, mechanical,electrical, and acoustical can decrease or increase for the better or the worst the right perception of timbre....

Reading my posts adequately then you would have understood that the difference between you and me is this fundamental fact of acoustic science: timbre is a phenomena captured and evaluated by the ears only.... the Nyquist theorem is only there to throw off your show of dust to dismiss anything out of the alternative you force people in : Analog OR digital...

Reality is more complex than your simple mind alternative between good and evil.... Sorry...

And by the way constantly menacing to end the conversation because your opponent is an alleged " idiot" is not an argument except if you take it seriously and mute yourself....It is a sure sign of your own insecurities like all people throw menaces in between or in place of arguments...

I am here to discuss with arguments not with a repeated slogan like: colored tone of analog system are a bunch of distortions and vinyl fads are ignorant...Or Nyquist theorem said so....

Timbre perception is more fundamental in acoustic than any theorem of the theory of signals, the reason is simple, it is the basic problem that is linked not only to acoustic in general but through liguistic to the survival and evolution of the human species... The learning process by which we perceive timbre speech make human master of the earth...

When someone knows what is timbre perception in music and acoustic then he knows that only human ears can decide and judge this perception...Modelling the descriptors of timbre perception with their neurological and acoustical correlates dynamics and their working in vector spaces and phase space goes mathematically way beyond your theorem....

Audio is the art to create AND perceive sound, analog AND digital here has their own reasons, their own way, and people with turntables are not all idiots unable to understand your engineering use of Fourier series with Nyquist theorem...

But being myself an "idiot", if you are right, you are not supposed to read my post anymore now, then i will not answer to ghost chanting mantras anymore myself....


Happy new year....

I have a question, on a 1/4" tape moving at 15 or 30 inches per SECOND, how much information is stored? If we were to translate ALL the noise on the tape, how many GIGs, (more like TERABYTES) do you think it would digitally be converted to? in ONE SECOND? I can answer part of this... As much as the software was programmed to look for, SO there is a programming issue too... Is it a problem? YES....

I've had to patch a LOT of peoples messed up programming... These guys/girls were suppose to be the BEST...
You have to have an understanding of music, it is NOT.. 0 and 1s. or on and offs... IT'S MUSIC....

IS the guy/gal writing the code, JO SMO at the local University of WHATEVER? or Working with Carlos Santana to understand, HOW to write the code because he/she is a musician at HEART, but writes code for a living.... BIG difference... Just like below...

Don’t let a language barrier, be the undoing of understanding..

I see EXACTLY that, here... I understand both positions, yet one cannot understand the other... Simple, need to work in the real world where the language of RESPECT is always universal... I’ve worked on job sites with 5 different languages, and 10 different dialects, were spoken. NEVER any misunderstandings.. EVER... the problem here, we can’t use hand signals...

Gentleman RESTART your engines... Your talking about two different things...

Regards...

@audio2design doesn't believe in timbre nor the difference between analog/infinity vs discrete/digital! Analog instruments don't sample...analog/infinite - very simple concept; granted within the bounds of manufacturing and human hearing but nothing is "discarded" or "sampled' like in digital.

I wish my more expensive digital system could sound like the less expensive vinyl setup, even using regular pressings, but it just doesn't - while mind you my DAC is one of the 10 best on the planet... I guess you can't contribute anything to explain this from your digital biased perspective so don't really care what you have to say anymore. In the face of numerous A vs D comparisons, I can't get the digital to compete...at twice the cost; maybe with DSD512... These are my explanations to understand why. 

Without noise reduction best you will ever get out of tape is about 90db, with 80db more realistic. I will give you 90 for interests sake. Bandwidth at full SNR is likely about 20KHz, but I will give you 30KHz.  Can't use noise reduction or any other emphasis-de-emphasis for this calc.

Bits in stereo max about 1.25 megabits/second equivalent data.


I do agree, there appear to be two races going on. One of us though is moving forward, and one just appears to be going in circles.  This little diddy pretty much illustrates that:

Seven: Nyquist theorem is about coding and decoding signals and also the implicit limitations and not only the power to do so.... This theorem has nothing to do directly with TIMBRE, which is the cornerstone of musical perception but more than that the cornerstone for evaluation of audio system in their acoustical controlled or uncontrolled embeddings...

At some point perhaps the links will be made that all audio is stored as simple 2 dimensional signals, time and value, whether done in the analog domain or digital domain, and that that eventually gets out to the speakers, and then your ear perceives a complex set of frequencies and intermixed timings as something described as timbre (but is still just a set of frequencies and timing), and hence how accurately it is possible to recreate the original "timbre" of the instrument comes down to how accurately one can recreate those frequencies and timings. One can reproduce them very accurately. One cannot. One can do everything the other one can do. The other cannot. This has nothing to do with what you like better, it is just a simple factual discussion.  Want to hear exactly what the microphone picked up, use digital. Want to hear a euphonic presentation that you (and others) may or may not prefer? Use analog.  Want the option? Use digital and explore the plug-ins available to add colorations and distortions and noise.

Some people want the world to be full of magic. Others simple roll up their sleeves and get things done.

It appears simple if you have a simplistic understanding of how things work. There is nothing "infinite" about analog recordings. Not even remotely. That you assign an infinite to them shows lack of understanding. That you think digital discards things, while analog recordings do not just shows more lack of understanding. Attacking me for holes in your knowledge is not a good look.  I seem to know exactly what timbre is, I just don't feel a need to attach special qualities to it beyond what it is.

Analog instruments don't sample...analog/infinite - very simple concept; granted within the bounds of manufacturing and human hearing but nothing is "discarded" or "sampled' like in digital.