Audio Science Review = "The better the measurement, the better the sound" philosophy

??? Our aim is the same as yours. We want maximum enjoyment out of our music and want to optimize our gear to get there.

@amir_asr

This neatly encapsulates what some may perceive as your apparent myopia, and the associated problem that many have with ASR. If you believe that the above is truly a shared goal, then why on earth would you insist that better measuring components necessarily produce better sound?

Do you really imagine that those countless audiophiles who derive immense enjoyment from tube amplifiers, or Nelson Pass amps, would somehow find even greater enjoyment through the use of amps with lower distortion? Do you not understand that many, if not most of them, have spent decades optimizing their gear for precisely the purpose that you mention?

Pass, as you probably know, conducts listening tests on his new amp designs, the results of which have typically led him to intentionally introduce some distortion. In other words, a high percentage of listeners in those tests preferred the sound signature of the amps with some added distortion.

I think that part of the problem is that you, and many objectivists, conflate "best sound" and accuracy. Yes, you might reasonably argue that components with the least amount of distortion are more likely to reproduce recordings more accurately than those which introduce some distortion, but to then assume that such sound is necessarily "better" is a dubious leap.

@fleschler

 

OldHvyMec at ASR makes cogent and experienced statements concerning "ALL things BREAK-IN." He has the reputation to make that assertion, especially in relation to cables/wires and equipment of all types (including audio).

HarmonicTHD member asserts "Cables are not mechanics. There is no wear, nor Burn-In, nor Break-In."

Then JSmith and Axo1989 talk about pancakes, off-topic and irrelevant.

This is a typical ASR dialogue.

Another poster introduced the pancakes, Reference to “moist” and “warm” is banter about descriptive terminology. Not irrelevant at all (I mentioned the ASR thread about “warm” in a post in this thread). That thread is about this thread, not about cables. You can join dots, surely?

@kota1 said:

” Did you join this forum simply to keep spamming this thread with your propaganda? I don’t think you are attracting any new members, from these posts of yours. “

Quite! + 1

@tsushima1 I get that he is attempting to defend his brand and of course, he has stated he is not running a charity either. He can bully members of ASR into buying name badges. He can bully manufacturers into hiring him as a "consultant" after attacking them on his site. But in the process of trying to defend his brand here he is using the same bullying tactics he uses at ASR. I think the end result is he is tarnishing his brand.

@amir_asr , no one here wants you to lose your income from selling name badges at ASR by jumping the shark. Why not use that passion for IT and objective data into something other than spamming us? Why not try engaging in some audio related threads other than this one. Participate, we won’t attack you if you are friendly, just try to remember, no one cares how much you know, until they know how much you care.

@laoman , assume I know nothing about wine and explain to me, in as much detail as necessary, why my analogy shows I know nothing about wine.

@kota1 , are you working from the perspective that if you tell a lie enough times it will become true?  Amir has been considerably more professional than those attacking him here.

@fleschler, I learned something about CDs today when I tried to find your posts on ASR. Unlike a record where the grooves may not be concentric with the center hole, the CD manufacturing process ensures the tight alignment of the hole and the grooves. While learning, I also saw someone note that if we can read CDs at 30-40x reliably, that reading at 1x is trivial. I also learned that even early CD players had data buffers, which in retrospect is obvious, but I never gave it much thought. What am I getting at?  The informed reaction to a device that shaves the outside of a CD should be skepticism. It would be very easy to test whether it makes a difference. I expect Amir's equipment would do this easily. 

@whipsaw , I agree and do not agree with some of your statement. I do agree that many users on ASR appear to equate perfect measurements with idealized sound for an individual. I do agree that is a flawed position. I do not know how strongly Amir believes in that position and I will not put words in his mouth as others are doing. I do know from reading these pages that Amir's comments have centered on whether audio products do what they say they do, including whether they do or can sound different from another product. Amir is stating based on his measurements that many products must sound the same or that they do not do what they claim. I think that is the more contentious issue. The issue of accuracy and preference is peripheral to the discussion.