I do too Charlesdad.
For right now I am going to put in some ampohm Copper Foil and might try the VCapcuft's I have here.
I just can not take the vintage anymore! Farrrrr too many flaws.
I am looking forward to hear some Jupiter caps! |
In a previous post I had mentioned the Ampohms sounded VERY much like vintage I want to test that again.
I also said once the vintage in the midrange did not sound a lot different than my VSF and I might revisit that one. It might be me hearing the resonance so much more now...
This high end cap stuff drives you nuts I can hear flaws so easy now even when the oil started to leak! |
I have the amp with all the Duelund caps in bak with a CAST I had here replacing the leaky one.
Waiting to get the replacement from Duelund.
At first amp sounded off but I had the tech guy check things over. New cap, new Genalex rectifier tube, new Genalex power tubes.
Sounding better now.
Grannyring
You know I am going to test these Jupiter caps that is some big claims on them you have made. |
Grannyring
Looking forward to hearing Jupiter caps in small values. Duelund does not give the discount on small value CAST anymore.
My vintage parts are wax paper and there for sure is some merit to it. Wax is really good in resonance reduction. The downside is maybe a slowing of high freq.. |
Grannyring
Too bad wrong size on the North Creek. I have a 2.5mh North Creek but did go to Duelund VSF. I wish I had even went to CAST. (one of the only regrets)
Treat inductors as every bit as important as caps if not more. Just shocking how much noise. (and VSF I would not expect to be at CAST level)
In my testing it was Duelund VSF, vintage wax paper then North Creek. North Creek might be one of the best out there not sure?
Inductors are the vastly underrated part and not understood. It is the high freq noise that gets cut... I was not expecting it. There is a lot on this thread with others who found it the same.
Of course money is always an object.
The point of this thread was improvement for the $ and Duelund inductors are right up there! |
Charlesdad
Still working in the hours the Jupiters are tight and damped when new...
They have opened up though.
Jupiter's are very low resonance for sure.
People who say caps do not matter is just crazy! Even the difference in good caps is big!
In order to use Duelund CAST in these tight spots major work was going to have to be done on the amp. I am for sure not doing that work and using the Jupiters.
Better than Duelund I need more time on them for that and more time for me.
Wax is different from oil like oil is different from Teflon. |
Wow I just read page #48 and have not read page #49!
I step out for a little while and Holy Smokes lots of action!
Just at the part about John K. (sorry if I say something in page #49!)
"If I mod'ed it it must be better". (posted by Johnk)
That is EXACTLY how this thread started! I swapped out one whole network (one speaker) and left the other original.
I (like most) was quite happy with my handy work and I brought my wife down for a listen as an unbiased opinion. She was totally impressed! She thought the difference was huge from the two networks and said "you must really be thrilled to get such an improvement"? (not having done any of this before)
The problem was she was picking the vintage foil in oil network NOT the new poly caps!...
I knew at that moment things were not going to be clear money was going to be spent and sometimes wasted and this was going to have to be wrote off as interesting experiment.
I knew I was going to have to listen lots.
Some did not like the mod one speaker listen for a long time if good do the mod to the other carry on method but as JohnK mentioned you can not test from memory.
In time (and after some failures) I got better at what would work and gained some understanding. As one's understanding grows so does the frustration with most new gear... (but I do know why high end parts are not used)
This thread is about people's opinions for the most part with nothing sell.
I have said (and is deserved) a lot of good about Duelund parts. Oddly enough though I am one who has had a Duelund CAST cap leak and in reality Duelund is the ONLY capacitor I have had fail.
Now Duelund will give a refund which leaves me with one CAST at the value... (not a common value)
I am using the store credit for some Jupiter caps, quite likely. I have to just see if they fit. My pace of alterations has slowed in recent years. Am I upset? No! I am not even looking at new gear which is a good thing! (very happy)
Johnk has been on this thread for a long time and has made some valid points but I believe he is a horn speaker builder.
I have said on here many times I would not want to build speakers with Duelund parts and try and make money!
Do the parts matter? YES! Would I want to use them build speakers to make money? NO! |
Interesting to read page #49.
Much talk about inductors. Oddly enough the part most will "draw the line" on and to be honest so would have I...
I have tried the vintage wax paper, North Creek and Duelund VSF. The North Creek was of a lower DCR and to me that is/was dangerous in changing tonal balance. With inductors my opinion is they MUST have a way of dealing with resonance.
Inductors make a BIG difference but do not get the hype of caps and resistors. I am not sure why? (even my vintage speakers used wax to deal with resonance)
The shocking thing was the Duelund gave a big high freq noise reduction in the woofer. I just did not expect that... (I was thinking more bass which it did but less noise?)
Maybe the biggest upside surprise to me was the money I spent on the inductors and have wondered many times if I should have got CAST...
That being said inductors are one off parts that are expensive. Mine are $559 each at current prices. The CAST ones are $1118 each all plus tax here... I paid a fair bit less...
As is being said on here I would not want to put $2k+ in inductors for parts for speakers to sell!!!
I think Jupiter could get into this making a high quality wax paper inductor. It would blow away anything else out there... (save CAST maybe) |
Took apart the amp today to check on room for the small value Jupiter caps.
What I seen was my other Duelund CAST cap is leaking the other one to the pair. It is a fairly new leak just started. (I could not hear it still sounds great) Not thrilled about second Duelund cap leaking bad batch? No other Duelund caps leaking...
Jupiters will go in early next week if in stock. |
|
Jupiter caps are here and there is a MASSIVE size difference from the CAST. Not saying the Jupiter will not sound good but is much closer in size to the vintage than the CAST. In fact Jupiter is much smaller than the Jensen Copper Paper tube caps.
The small size might come in handy as CAST are not easy to put everywhere. In my amp I know there is spots where there just is not room for a CAST cap. |
Jupiters installed in the phono stage. (small values)
Reduction in record surface noise and more bass as compared to the vintage caps they replaced.
They are much easier to work with in this case and might have been the only option due to size compared to Jensen or Duelund.
More to follow and soon direct comparison to a Jensen Copper Foil Paper tube coming. (can not yet compare to CAST due to them coming out because of leaks) |
I see Jimmy has a some Jupiter's in for a test but has not posted the results.
Any speculation???
He also has Duelund CAST Silvers. So he will not be an easy guy to impress.
He too was shocked by just how small they are.
For me I had some areas that would require major work to fit in something like the CAST or even Jensen. So these are great!
So far though I do like the Jupiter's as replacements for the vintage. Much better bass much lower noise...
I am going to try and get some more hours in on them as I leave for a couple of days but am looking at ordering 4 more of the small value caps.
My thoughts before they went in they might be slow and damped in sound? I have some experience in wax paper (inductors) great for resonance reduction but not so slippery fast like silk. |
Back from being away for a week.
I have been reading Jimmy has not completed his review too busy and Tony Gee has had these caps for months?
I have put in two and will have a bunch more this week coming.
I can say they are similar to the CAST in revealing wear in the vinyl. They are low noise and I was thinking I was going to have to do major mods on a vintage amp to put small value caps in but these Jupiter's fit the bill size wise! Now are they better than CAST? That is a serious listening test.
I am also looking at caps for my office system to replace vintage caps and would give up a little quality over CAST to save some money. So that could mean more sales for Jupiter.
I also might replace my other leaky CAST with some Duelund RS?
Duelund does not make CAST at lower prices for my size of cap. Quite frankly CAST might just be too expensive for the difference?
The Duelund RS is more in the price range of the Jupiter's. More but not crazy more if one was to like them better.
Looks like some interesting comparisons coming up!
Initial impressions of the Jupiter's is very good.
When I take out the CAST the first test will be Jupiter vs. Jensen Copper Paper Tube.
I have to say this thread has worked out even for me much better than I ever thought. Quickly from opinions here I could buy a cap (Jupiter in this case) and kind of know what I was getting. (when this thread started it was a lot of trial and error and often at a good deal of money)
I do not believe this was possible before the internet. Publications who might do this would be tied to advertising.
Off to watch a movie on the stereo and have to admit just awesome watching a movie with this kind of sound quality in two channel. |
Grannyring
I guess I just have to hear this! (CAST vs. Jupiter)
Not saying you are wrong and can not wait to hear what Jimmy and Tony think as well...
If as good or close to as good I intend to buy quite a few... (tight spots) |
Grannyring
I have actually been listening to the regular Beeswax caps from Jupiter (compared to vintage) they sent the wrong ones.
Can you tell me what to expect for the difference? Have you heard both?
The Copper ones should be in by Wednesday is my guess.
I could not get over how small they were compared to CAST. (which may come in handy)
For sure lower resonance than vintage.
I thought they were pretty good but saying CAST good was a head scratching stretch... |
Looking forward to them! Should be here today and I will install right away. The Copper Foil are bigger than the standard ones. Interesting on the Beeswax Tony gave them 11.5 another reviewer did not like at all? My initial impression was Tony was about right.
I wonder about wax in general very low resonance more than oil? I would think so... Could prove to be very useful in the phono stage where these are going.
Anyone tried Duelund RS? That is my only other option since CAST is out of the question. (now price wise for small special values)
When done EVERY single cap in my amp will be Jensen Copper Foil Paper Tube, Duelund CAST, Duelund VSF, Jupiter Copper Foil and maybe a couple Jupiter Beeswax.
Anyone else have the entire amp with high end caps? |
6 Jupiter Coppers to install! |
4 installed.
The leak on the CAST happens right at the lead...
More to follow. |
Well the Jupiters are not fully broke in but I do have some early thoughts.
These caps are heavily damped. Wax seems to be lower noise than oil caps. So in that sense some may prefer them. This might be similar to when I tested wax paper tweeter inductor vs. Duelund VSF. That was a tough one as the Duelund was more liquid and let more sound through but noisier.
On tone controls I have brought treble up from -2 to -4 up to at least neutral.
I will say Jupiter caps do not add to the sound romanticize if you wish.
This is going to be a wax vs. oil test...
I am going to put the Duelund tweeter inductor in again for another try.
Now I read on Tony Gee's site the new RS caps from Duelund are wax? Is this correct anyone know? |
Grannyring
My guess is 20 hours?
From partsconnexion I heard the Duelund RS are wax?
Do we have wax vs. oil going on here? |
If so that makes the RS very different than CAST an oil cap clearly.
I wish Duelund would chime in here and clear some air and as to why the switch? |
On the more follow I was talking about.
One of the leads just fell off the Jupiter Copper Foil. When installing the other ones I was being so careful it was crazy and then another fell off.
I have never had a lead of ANY cap fall off and the vintage ones are crazy strong...
A little frustration lately with all of this two CAST caps leaked and two Jupiter caps leads fell off. |
Will do Charles
If you remember I could not use the Duelund WPIO tweeter inductor? The vintage wax one was quieter but there was DCR change.
I can say much like using Poly caps and oil it was weird in stereo at first different discharge rates?
The Jupiter's to me were dead out of the box but do change in time maybe more than the CAST did.
I can say I have been quite impressed with the high end clarity!
Still looking for faults with the mindset you are thinking. |
Piling on the hours on the Jupiter caps. I know this will set off a firestorm.
Jupiter's are not noisy in any way have a clear top end (sometimes intoxicatingly clear) but I just do not find them in the league of the CAST in dynamics...
I will continue to give more of a listen but right now I am ticked that my CAST leaked and I do not have replacements...
Options are tying RS?
The CAST is likely 5x the volume in size of Jupiter and well, sounds it. I have yet ever to find a smaller cap a more dynamic cap...
Am I upset with the Jupiter's? No in the tight area of my amp the small size of the cap (and affordable price) is an asset and the CAST would not fit without big modifications... (plus big $$$ in several caps)
I am not sure to this day I agree with Tony's scores. I originally thought 17 for CAST would be about right. I am not sure why he rates other caps so close? Not to me...
I also have the Beeswax Jupiter's and I do not find or have not heard at least yet a big difference to the Copper's...
Tony quote on Jupiter Beeswax (good description not offensive in any way)
"I find them very pleasing to listen to".
I expect Tony to rate the Jupiter Copper's around 12?
That is my early guess... Oh how I would love the $33 cap to better the $200 one |
Charles
For sure the Jupiter's more like CAST than the VCap's. I think they have some fine traits as well. I wonder if we all put different weights on different things? Plus is there a measurement of how much energy is stored in a cap? When replacing the vintage ones with Jupiter's the noise level dropped which is good the resonance dropped as well but not big change in dynamics... |
If the Jupiter was 5x bigger...
I have not ever yet found the smaller type cap of the same type to be more dynamic.
Sonicaps vs. Mundorf
Jensen vs. vintage
CAST vs. VSF
Vintage vs. vintage.
Even in the sought after vintage amps the caps were bigger than the not so desirable vintage amps... |
Have completed the Jensen Copper Paper tube vs. the Jupiter Copper test.
My choice would be the Jensen. The cap that gets almost no attention has not even been rated by Tony Gee which is only a notch below the Duelund caps.
The Jupiter is quiet but frustratingly lacks the dynamics of the Jensen which lacks the dynamics of the CAST.
I keep thinking what if the Jupiter was 5x bigger??? (CAST is at least 5x bigger)
This brings me to my problem.
Duelund does not sell my values in the lower price for CAST, but is bragging up the RS series as a lower cost replacement. The problem is Duelund is bragging the smaller size of the cap... Is this really something we want???
Every cap I have ever tried of the same type the bigger one has been more dynamic... (and always wins)
So what is the RS a cheaper CAST? less copper etc.?
Has anyone tried the RS? I am a little nervous of them...
I wish my CAST did not leak! |
Charles
Yes audio is subjective in the sense of tone. I could easily the less energy of the Jupiter's. Should it have been anything else? The CAST is way bigger. I am still waiting for the smaller cap to be as dynamic.
I am not even upset with the Jupiter's performance. Major work would have needed to be done to fit CAST.
Are they better than the vintage they replaced? Much quieter.
Grannyring I agree the Jensen's are a tad muffled loose in the bass. The Jensen comparison was in the amp section not the phono that was against vintage.
I still find the Duelund CAST in a league of their own in respect to energy. I found them much quieter than say the VSF not better tone just a lot more energy and stiffer.
Hence the question how big does a cap need to be to max out dynamics?
Mundorf Supreme were much bigger than Sonicaps and the tone was similar but the Mundorfs were much more dynamic...
Grannyring can you still compare CAST vs. Jupiter's in just this one context? Not which is quieter because the Jupiter have a very clear top end. Give the cap something hard to work with like live concert. |
Irish65
Good to see you post again!
Have you tried the RS series? I am going to put an order in as replacements for my leaking CAST today.
I found going down much harder to go than it was getting better caps!
For the first time Duelund is making me a bit nervous/concerned. The RS is smaller which I have never found to be great with any style of cap... (unless you just do not have the room) |
Grannyring and Ricevs
I am going to try this as well. I know removing a screw in the woofer signal was one of the biggest upgrades I have got so far and it cost nothing.
It was truly shocking the signal went through a cheap screw.
Duelund RS caps are here. I would say about 40% shorter than CAST. Hopefully a chance to install very soon. |
Interesting.
This thread oddly enough started with bi-amped Linn speakers. Linn also is into Aktiv. (as they call it)
In terms of value for the $ I think straight bi-amp or tri-amp is maybe the worst value! In my speakers I could barely hear the difference of a second $5k amp running through a crossover made with max. $20 in parts...
Yet I could hear easily changing cheap crossover parts to better ones.
Sometimes the change was so great like CAST tweeter caps I thought I wired something up wrong...
This would go back to a balance Steen Duelund had talked about 50% of the $ in the speakers, 50% of the $ in the speakers in the crossover.
Here I am fretting over not having CAST in a single spot in the integrated amp. (with Duelund RS being the likely replacement)
Going active would mean three amps with CAST caps plus the cost of the active crossover... Plus three times the Duelund Silver 2.0 wire.
I have yet to ever hear small parts sound better so what would an active crossover cost with big parts?
It is not a road I am going down as I am already on the simple few high quality part road. |
Grannyring
For sure on the 200 hours. (much more)
I am not anti Jupiter and will be installing more. The phono stage in this amp will be all Jupiter. They are very quiet. For the money not bad...
The caps mentioned on here are all good ones. The VCap Cuft I have tried are lightning fast but just not my cup of tea.
It has been mentioned on here before put 10 people in front of TV's and you might get a consensus on best picture on sound, no way...
I like horn speakers so my brain must forgive their faults and focus on the strengths. (which to most is dynamics)
The CAST I believe was designed for horn speakers. |
The Tannoy Westminster crowd that is putting in CAST love them.
I find CAST is stunning in dynamics. The Jupiter's are good at the noise reduction but the dynamics are just not there. Now if the cap was 5x bigger???
My guess is someone who likes horn speakers will love CAST.
I have not heard CAST in non horn speakers so I can not comment in that area.
I wish there was a measurement of how much energy was stored in each cap. My guess is CAST stores the most has ultra low resonance, Jupiter very low noise but would store less energy and the VCap would charge and discharge the fastest. |
Merry Christmas to all.
I have much to read on here to "catch up".
I guess we all have different preferences when listening and what we can forgive. Grannyring finds the CAST too tipped upward for warmth. In comparison to Jupiter I would not argue. I have had to turn up the treble in my system when using the Jupiter.
Wax clearly tilts the sound down to me and is dull. I find a loss of high frequency energy and a loss of realism. I have yet to install the Duelund RS which is wax as well.
They could be of the same as Jupiter. I think they will have more energy due to the much larger size but might tilt sound down?
Oil is livelier but (to me) more realistic. To me oil lets the signal flow and really on the high freq and wax is very good at noise reduction. I am sure wax by nature would have less noise than oil.
I also find the Jupiter's not to be of real world dynamics. This could be a simple fix a MUCH bigger capacitor. If the Jupiter was 5x bigger??? Hmmm...
This is not to say I do not like Jupiter caps they are very quiet. To me the best I have heard so far is CAST.
Clearly though Duelund thought something good of wax if they used it in the RS series. I have used my vintage tweeter inductor over the Duelund VSF I have. My gut feeling is oil is better but harder to control resonance and wax is a cheap way to do it, but at a cost of liveliness.
I will try and get the RS installed tomorrow... That way it can be wax vs. oil.
Duelund vs. Duelund (unfortunately from memory of CAST) I do know about how much better CAST was than Jupiter Copper Paper Tube. |
In all the testing I have done in 4 years here I have yet to find the smaller capacitor be more dynamic than a bigger one given a cap of the same style.
The Mundorf Supreme was much more dynamic than a Sonicap...
I expect the Duelund RS to be more dynamic than the Jupiter. (much bigger) possibly less dynamic than a CAST as it is smaller.
Tony Gee seemed to quite like the RS second best cap was his take. |
Happy New Year to all!
Getting pumped to get the soldering iron going!
This thread was meant to not declare an official cap winner but to give someone an idea of what to expect when installing caps and to know their priorities upfront.
My priorities (with horn speakers) are natural tone, noise reduction, dynamics.
If ultra micro detail was my priority V Cap would be the cap of choice.
I am more in the Jupiter/Duelund camp. I have to be careful not sounding as keen on Jupiter. If space is tight they are my top choice... So I do like them. If money is brought into the equation many will go the Jupiter route.
If money no object? CAST or what value for the $ is RS? I will soon find out... |
Junker
I was glad to see on Tony Gee cap review he retreated the Supremes up to 10 from 9.
He had them rated not much better than Sonicaps and to me they were much better. (good value and better than the Silver in Oil I thought)
Jet
Duelund is all about the rich tonal pallet...
There is some good value caps out there Mundorf Supreme, Jupiter. No need for new builds to use cheap crappy parts... |
Sorry plus Jupiter Copper foils in office amp.
It sounds pretty damn good, for sure wayyyy better than stock and will get another chance at main amp.
I have to say all three caps are excellent! (Duelund, VCap Cuft and Jupiter)
My office system used to sit unused till these caps went in. (just too far below other amp)
I am getting more use than ever. |
Installed the Duelund RS plus finished installing Jupiter's in the phono stage and moved Jupiter to office system and the VCap Cuft I have as well. (all tonight)
Spent a few hours listening tonight and first impression is promising. (of the RS)
I see Tony Gee has some Jupiter Copper Foil caps for speakers. It will be interesting his take.
My take is Jupiter is dead quiet around the voices instruments not as real sounding as Duelund. (over damped sound)
I left the Jupiter vs. Jensen Copper Foil in for a long time. Which one would I get? The Jupiter's (especially if the cost was lower) but neither as good as any Duelund to me. I just can not get enough of the full rich organic sound.
The Duelund just sound so right. With the Jupiter I missed the CAST. Tonight was the longest I have enjoyed music since the CAST leaked and were taken out. |
The RS are getting some hours on them. My guess is they sound very close to VSF that I have already.
Like Junker said a great deal of tone, neutrality, detail and spatiality.
Even after 4 years of doing this I am still stunned at what difference even 1 cap makes!
You would think all higher end caps would converge on a similar sound. Not at all the case.
Jupiter vs. Duelund RS.
First of all I have tone controls. (so imbalances easily corrected)
With the Jupiter's I treble is set to neutral with the Duelund it is -2.
The Jupiter's create an absolute black background that is beyond belief. (literally beyond belief) A singer will have blackness around their voice that does not sound natural to me.
The Duelund's are not so tidy but oh sooooo organic sounding.
Grannyring has mentioned things to reduce noise like the sand etc. if one is looking to reduce noise Jupiter is "the" cap...
The Duelund's are just so natural sounding. The RS sat here for close to a month me not putting them in. I was somewhat worried Duelund was going to go all super low noise in the Jupiter direction being wax. To be honest the first time I was not excited about Duelund.
You have heard it from me on here before I wanted a cap between the CAST and VSF but closer to CAST. The RS might be that cap? Not sure yet but like the VSF sounds very good right out of the box CAST took some break in.
My phono stage is now all Jupiter after that all Duelund. (have not listened yet) I might do up one of the other amps with RS and maybe some of those Silver CAST? |
Grannyring
I agree I believe we both hear the caps exactly the same. The original point of this thread was to give a person an idea of what to expect. Caps of course provide HUGE change in sound but the resale is obviously poor. So nice to avoid poor choices.
I moved the Jupiter caps to my bedroom system which knowing how they sound is the kind of sound I am looking for there. (using still in phono stage)
Without a doubt Jupiter's are quieter. I can not imagine a quieter cap. When there is a singer the voice is suspended with an uncanny pitch blackness around it. Just crazy and this was with one cap!
Jupiter's are also quieter than CAST or any cap that I have heard?
The downside is the Jupiter's are quieter than the actual event. (to me)
The RS shine in organic bloom, nice weight, natural sound, real feeling venue energy. (at the expense of what can be perceived as noise)
Not sure if you are aware of this Grannyring but Steen used vintage caps before making his own. (VSF) Vintage caps are not low resonance. So his voicing would tend toward that direction.
My amps are vintage and Duelund caps are wayyyy better versions in all ways but still in the same area. |
I have not used them and likely will not just due to price.
Would like to hear myself what some think.
Read U.K. Stereo magazine today HiFi choice?
Talking about how they thought for many years the source was the most important thing. (being Linn LP12 guys which I have an older loaded LP 12 as well) They have a pic of my speakers (co-incident) (Klipsch Lascala) and talk about how they do things modern speakers can not.
They think the issue stems back to the mono age when one big speaker was how you created life like image. When two channel stereo came out speakers became smaller and the importance of the source grew.
Now they are not so sure it was correct.
They likened the comparison to old film cameras that took very good quality pictures but did not have the quality of today's lenses but since they used a much larger film format it did not matter.
Meaning big speakers (horns in this case) do not need as precise a source to create life like sound.
I never thought I would hear this (main stream audio magazine) but maybe Steen's thoughts on the speakers being the most important part of the system is coming back? Now take the Lascala's they are listening too and mod them to the hilt like mine with all Duelund and there is NO comparison to stock and become quite refined! (and life like tone like crazy) |
HiFi News a long article about the Denman horn from 1929.
Absolute monster over 7' high square at mouth and 27' long.
Clearly not made for your living room but Denman did make one for his house. (Predating Japanese audiophiles) Apparently astonishing sound. WE 555W driver of which Klipsch tried to copy.
That speaker (mono era) spawned the folded horn to use the walls and no doubt save space.
I know Steen Duelund was into horns and making huge horns. Based on the Denman horn?
Today Duelund is thought of as caps and resistors but Steen had a wide interest in Audio.
I would be interesting to hear from Duelund what was Steen's thoughts? |
Hoping we get a report on the Duelund hybrid caps. |
Justubes2
Just checking up on the thread been a month or so.
I do want to clarify on the CAST's leaking I was given a full refund. It was a bad batch I hear? I really just wanted them replaced.
With that money refund I tried Jupiter Copper Foil and the leads broke off a couple of those caps. I am more concerned about build quality of the Jupiter caps as the leads are very fragile. These were small value .01uf caps.
With the rest of the money I replaced the Jupiter with Duelund RS and like them very much. I could not do a direct comparison to CAST vs. RS as the CAST had leaked and were gone.
I will have to take Tony Gee's word on this one that the CAST's are a blacker background.
To me the CAST's midrange (that you mentioned them being very good) is key. If you do not get the midrange correct it always sounds like HiFi?
After all these years of testing and listening (to what some would call small detail) there has been one big negative I have become much more sensitive and frustratingly so. When my CAST cap started to leak it was not seeing the oil that tipped me off to a problem it was I could hear something wrong! (took off bottom of amp and sure enough CAST was leaking so much for theory one can not hear a difference in caps!) At Starbucks the other day I literally could not stay and read some magazines and had to go outside on the patio. The natural sounds outside do not bother me the horrific sound system in Starbucks is literally nails down a chalkboard. (literally 90% just noise)
Cancelled Sirius radio in the car horrible sound, can not listen to compressed radio stations, about half of CD's are unbearable in car. In the car with my teenage daughter we play dad guess the bit rate of the recording on her iPhone. I guess it's great the kids think dad is amazing! (very accurate guess)
Even my bedroom system (which is still pretty good filled with VCap cuft, Jupiter and Jensen caps) I can not listen to long as I still have vintage caps in the tweeters and they are crap. (very noisy)
justubes2 you have given me the idea to replace the tweeter cap (in bedroom system) with a sitting around Mundorf Silver in oil I already have. To me I remember an artificial tilt to the sound with that cap. (upwards)
But I do like to revisit things to see if I feel the same years later.
I also am using CAST followed by VSF in the tweeters in main system and would like to revist that to maybe CAST CAST. (reason is less noise)
To anyone who stumbles on this thread that is your warning. It sounds good to hear the difference in what some would say something as trivial a cap until you understand it's full implications.
I think there is something with age and noise. As we age we want to listen to music (and enjoy) but the tolerances for noise really decrease. |
Justubes2
" I have a very itchy feeling it would work very well in the tweeter blocking function".
I have much to read here to catch up but agree with this statement.
The Jupiter is the quietest cap I have heard. I find it lack CAST or RS dynamics but is stunningly quiet. |
On the other side Jupiter and RS at 2uf are the same price in which case I would go RS and move my VSF to bedroom speakers |
Justubes2
"The virture of the cap with the best midrange, always sacrifices the openess and sparkle".
Have you tried the VSF? It is natural like the CAST but has more sparkle as you say but in reality it is noisier.
I do use the VSF after the CAST and at the time preferred it to two CAST's.
I guess my priorities are on the crucial midrange. I do not want to be aware I am listening to a stereo at all and if the mid range is not good? It always feels like a stereo.
I am going through all the posts trying to catch up and am also glad to hear about the Audio Note caps. (power supply)
This thread has worked out wildly beyond my imagination in the beginning! So many great inputs from so many enthusiasts that one can read (yes extremely long) and get a very good idea of what to do and expect.
We also have great choices now in a product (caps) that maybe at one time was thought maybe to not matter or matter much. In here it is the same caps over and over. Duelund Jupiter and Vcap.
I must say VCap's seem to be robustly built. |
Grannyring
"That is my exact finding with the Jupiter caps which are now my go to also. Perfectly balanced. I like the CAST, but have found time and again they are tilted upward in the upper mids".
I find the Jupiter's are bar none the quietest cap out there. To anyone reading this post I think Grannyring's priorities are absolute noise reduction.
To me I would say if the Jupiter was physically 3 to 5x bigger I might have to agree with Grannyring. I find Jupiter lacks dynamics of the Duelund line.
Oddly not many on here talk about dynamics? Where I think Duelund is wildly successful!
Now the blackness around everything with Jupiters is really something to hear if that is one's thing. Everything is carved out of blackness. |
