2. tech-talk
  3. 1365449923

Hi-Fi Fuses - SNAKE OIL? - or something in it?

There's a lot of chatter about the benefits of those high prices gold plated fuses with silver conductor etc. etc. all over the web and the consensus ranges from FANTASTIC!!! to much more subtle observations.

It makes sense to me, epseically in light of spending lots of $$$ on good power cables, that having a skinny piece of aluminum conductor in a glass tube (i.e. a cheap fuse), in the power loop would be detrimental to the performance of the components.

I decided to revamp my DIY power supply I'd built for the Cambridge Audio 640p phono stage and DACmagic in order to test this out - and since it's a DIY project there is no UL Certification to void.

First, I bypassed the fuse link completely to confirm there would be an improvement and give me the best benchmark to compare against - YEP - BIG DIFFERENCE - much more this, that and the other :-)

So then I started looking for hi-fi fuses - WOW!!! - talk about pricey.

Two fuses for the power supply was going to cost $120+ AND I thought I'd probably have to buy a better quality fuse block to make the most of those fuses.

Then a moment of enlightenment - most power supplies and conditioners are protected by pushbutton breakers and not fuses.

I found breakers of the required current rating and installed them into the power supply. I imediately noticed that there was no deteriation in fidelity when compared to the same unit with the fuse link bypassed - GREAT!.

On reflection, the fuses I had in place were rated at 3 amps - so they use a pretty thin fuse wire in them. If I had used a fuse of a higher rating, i.e. it uses a thicker conductor, then I believe that there would be less of a difference between the fused and bypassed implementations

SO - do the expensive fuses work?

Well the empirical evidence out there would suggest they do
- I do know the cheap fuses are not good!

I know bypassing them does improve the sound - a lot in my case
- BUT THAT'S NOT SAFE FOR ONGOING USE

I know breakers work as good as bypassing the fuse
- BUT MESSING WITH A POWER SUPPLY VOIDS UL CERTIFICATION - NOT GOOD!
- FYI a couple of licensed technicians I know WILL NOT change the design of a power supply at all.

I believe the amount of benefit is related to the fuse rating
- but don't go replacing 3 amp fuses with a 20 amp fuse - that's not safe either.

Whilst looking for fuses I discovered AMR Gold fuses priced at $20/fuse.

Now that's definately more affordable than most others at 3-4 times their price.

One supplier I know of in the US is Avatar Aacoustics

If you have had experience with quality fuses please share - especially if they are "modestly priced" i.e. $20-$30 per fuse. And please provide a source :-)

Also, can anypne confirm that Slow blow fuses are better than regular?

And Remember - IF YOU AIN'T LICENCED - GET A TECHNICIAN!

Many Thanks
williewonka
lacee
811 posts
 
You may hear similarities in speakers, a house sound from Magnepan, and while all the Maggies strive for 100% accuracy,you can still hear that they all perform differently.

Striving for 100% by measurements, doesn't mean the same sound.
You can get many different types of speakers to measure 100% accuracy or at least close to it,but some folks would find that too Sterile,Harsh and not warm and cuddly.

The same as you can measure capacitors and make sure that they all meet the same specs, but why then do they not all sound the same?

Why does a 300B tube sound different than an el35, el84, or 845?

They all meet spec measusrements, yet each one can change the sound of the amp they are in, and each have certain tonal characteristics that differentiate them.

All the "fusers" are stating is that all fuses do not sound the same either.

Whether your gear would benefit or not, I can't say.

What I can say is that attention to the small stuff pays off in the end.
It's cumulative.

If I were you,before I bought any fuses or any new wires or changed anything in your system, I would address the power going into your set up.

Specifically, dedicated power lines.

If you start to clean things up at the panel and work towards your speakers,you'll start to hear differences and make sense of all this voodoo.

It's like cleaning your eyeglasses.

You never realized how dirty they were until you cleaned them.
All the while you thought you could see good enough before you cleaned them.

Same as audio.
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,520 posts
 
Lacee,

That's a reasonable perspective to have for these kinds of things I would say. :^)
gvasale's avatar
gvasale
99 posts
 
Thanks...however, in the years I've had my ears in this, the "experts" always said that the goal was to have the sound that was as close to undistinguishable as possible to the original. Sterile, harsh, not warm & cuddly suggest to me they have'nt achieved the goal.

On a slightly different drift, I my memory is correct, when AR did their live vs. "memorex" auditions, they were pretty successful in this endeavor & at one time held a massive share of the loudspeaker market.

When they did their testing they actually buried their boxes
level to the surface of an outdoor field & did their measurements. The object was that there would be no room influence. Alternatively, very few others used anechoic chambers. These two things make me wonder about all the small baffles where the sound is not being projected away from the speaker & if there might be some "hocus-pocus" with some speakers which "can't be placed against a wall."

Not likely I'm ever going to replace what I own, though, but
I really do enjoy the music & enjoy the reading here & at other sites.

Eyeglasses...bad comparason. I can't stand either dirty glasses or polycarbonate lenses. I don't care if glass is heavier, I can see the difference. Give me glass.
dragon1952
181 posts
 
IMO, to say that an upgraded fuse or power cord can't improve SQ because it "defies the laws of physics", or some other science, implies physicists and other scientists have learned 100% of everything there is to possibly know...which is pretty naive or arrogant if you ask me.
lacee
811 posts
 
Inasmuch as those same AR speakers would be bested by most entry level sub $500.00 speakers of today, I am not sure folks would be as fooled as they were back in the old days.

That's a little like saying those same folks who viewed a 1950's TV wouldn't find much difference in a 4HD or whatever they call the latest in television technology.

I can say that my Aqos HD blows away my Marantz RPG, which back in the day was at the top of it's game.

Audio has moved on, and I admit that some of the old stuff is still good even today.
My old 1974 Acoustat montor X's are testament to that.
Except for the fact that they have had a few thousand dollars worth of upgraded parts.

The upgraded parts are the reason the Acoustats sound as good as they do.I know, before I had them upgraded, I knew how they used to sound back in the 70s.

But all the rest of the stuff I plug into the chain is also better than it was in the 70's.

I've put a lot of effort into getting the best electrical connection as I can to my gear,which means dedicated lines, upgraded connectors and even fuses.

All the stuuf that others will say can make no difference, has for me and in every other system where the owner has done similar improvemnts.

In fact listening to the before and after effects of some simple revisions to the power delivery to my friends system took me down the same road and I am very happy I did follow along.
My problem is that I don't have finances to pursue it to the level that he has.
And he is still experimenting with different power cords and their effect on his DCS dac.

So when does it all end?

It doesn't have to end,who says it's supposed to?

It can begin with a simple fuse, and end there I suppose, but what's the fun in that?
More to discover