One more unwanted opinion. I did a lot of ob research and settled on the Lii’s; crystal 10 and w15 woofers with crossovers. First time fun and just started and not dialed in but impressed. I am coming from electrostats and a hiatus and kef before that. Little Betsy and eminence alpha woofers is a good entry point for fun. Maybe mark audio. Decware also makes interesting drivers (more expensive) I have not heard any. Visaton 200b . That in short is what I came across other than mentioned.
Manger Audio Loudspeakers. Has anyone listened to these?
I am particularly fond of full range loudspeakers. I am not terrifically fond of whizzer cone designs because to make them work you have to decouple the main cone from the voice coil at high frequencies, a mechanical crossover.
As I understand it, the Manger driver is a flat Walsh driver. It will cover 120 Hz to 40 kHz! This will just make it down to subwoofer territory. Other full range drivers include Cube Audio and Fostex both of standard construction and both decouple the voice coil from the main cone at higher frequencies. Is this really all that bad or can it be done maintaining high fidelity? I have not heard any of them. Both the Manger and Cube drivers are very expensive, in and around $5000 for a pair. So, I can not afford to experiment. The Fostex is cheap in comparison but it looks well made and specs fine.
I plan on making a pair of open baffle "full range" speakers crossing to subs in and around 100 Hz. Which driver to use?
As I understand it, the Manger driver is a flat Walsh driver. It will cover 120 Hz to 40 kHz! This will just make it down to subwoofer territory. Other full range drivers include Cube Audio and Fostex both of standard construction and both decouple the voice coil from the main cone at higher frequencies. Is this really all that bad or can it be done maintaining high fidelity? I have not heard any of them. Both the Manger and Cube drivers are very expensive, in and around $5000 for a pair. So, I can not afford to experiment. The Fostex is cheap in comparison but it looks well made and specs fine.
I plan on making a pair of open baffle "full range" speakers crossing to subs in and around 100 Hz. Which driver to use?
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Good evening... More accurately, a Manger (and Walsh drivers) are 'bending wave transducers' that create a 'ripple' in their surface element, as opposed to pistonic motion of the voice coil on a cone. In a Manger, this is a flat 'plate' membrane; in a Walsh, a cone typically inverted & stretched in its' vertical axis. The Walsh-style driver is used in Ohm speakers, which are omnis in nature. The Mangers' are used more like a typical driver, mounted on the face of a cabinet. You might look this over: https://www.tectonicaudiolabs.com/ Both share the physics behind DML (Distributed Mode) Loudspeakers; 'flat membrane' speakers, which range from the 'poster speakers' (which look like a picture/painting of some size, hung on the wall) to hall arrays; the best of which I've found are: https://www.tectonicaudiolabs.com/product/pl-12-distributed-mode-loudspeaker/?id=product-805 I find this variant appealing in that two DML panels flank a AMT ribbon driver, very similar to my large ESS Heils...*S* For one with a reeallly large listening space, one could go extreme: https://www.tectonicaudiolabs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/NEWPL12-HDR-10-SPKR-LINE-ARRAY.png Better Walsh radiators can be found @ German-Physiks.com, but be prepared for the prices... http://www.hhr-exoticspeakers.com ...not only offers new versions of the 'original' Ohm speakers, but offers a 'stand-alone' Walsh radiator very similar to the G-P drivers.... ...and quite like the drivers I DIY for my own amusement. ;) Enjoy your music the way you do, J |
@bondmanp , There certainly is, Open Baffle! @ncdogdoc , Interesting that you heard this and I think you are absolutely right. The reason is probably that these speakers and planar speakers are strongly directional which limits room interference Rickderuyter, Thanx, had not hear of those either. @asvjerry , That is what I was alluding to. The Techtonic drivers have IMHO two failures. They are very inefficient, 82 dB/1watt/meter at best and they disperse over 180 degrees. Optimal in a 16 X 30 foot room is 45 to 60 degrees. Wide dispersion increases room interaction corrupting the image. Wide dispersion speakers add energy from the room at 3-4kHz increasing sibilance. Some sibilance is due to bad recording but most is due to the room! Recordings of female voices and violins I once thought were bad turned out to be fine when I switched to directional speakers. |
Agreed, DMLs' are not efficient....noting that Techtonics' PL-12 panels can coast @ 350 RMS whereas the ribbon is one-sixth of that. DML's are noted for the wide dispersion, and a 'horn loaded' ribbon would mate well with that. A Tech rep @ NAMM '16 ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w91Vfp8bp0 ) claims 'no room interaction', but I'll assume he's referring to a 'large room', if not a hall. *L* They're certainly not like any 'Maggie' one might compare them to....;) An early reference to Mangers' details a 'back to back' arrangement; my 'seat of the pant's' observation would indicate that the large magnet's would defeat any useful dipole radiation....mho, for what it's worth... (That, and a dollar might get one a cross-town bus tix....*G*) '16x30'....Is that 'w x d', or the reverse? I've typically lived in the 'd x w' situation, which certainly effects my experience of things audio...that, and 'age-related high end roll-off' which is basically inevitable. ;) |
@asvjerry , age sucks. And the Mangers do have a very large motor behind the membrane or whatever it is. I'm leaning towards the Fostex driver. It looks well made and is relatively inexpensive. If this approach works out well I might go to a more expensive driver but you can forget about $59K. 16 X 30 would be w x d, speakers on the 16 foot wall with a listening position mid way in the room. 45 degrees will cover wall to wall at that distance putting the primary reflection to the side of the listener out of harms way. |
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