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Manger Audio Loudspeakers. Has anyone listened to these?

I am particularly fond of full range loudspeakers. I am not terrifically fond of whizzer cone designs because to make them work you have to decouple the main cone from the voice coil at high frequencies, a mechanical crossover.
As I understand it, the Manger driver is a flat Walsh driver. It will cover 120 Hz to 40 kHz! This will just make it down to subwoofer territory. Other full range drivers include Cube Audio and Fostex both of standard construction and both decouple the voice coil from the main cone at higher frequencies. Is this really all that bad or can it be done maintaining high fidelity? I have not heard any of them. Both the Manger and Cube drivers are very expensive, in and around $5000 for a pair. So, I can not afford to experiment. The Fostex is cheap in comparison but it looks well made and specs fine.
I plan on making a pair of open baffle "full range" speakers crossing to subs in and around 100 Hz. Which driver to use?
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mijostyn OP
8,570 posts
 
@bondmanp , There certainly is, Open Baffle!

@ncdogdoc , Interesting that you heard this and I think you are absolutely right. The reason is probably that these speakers and planar speakers are strongly directional which limits room interference 
Rickderuyter, Thanx, had not hear of those either.

@asvjerry , That is what I was alluding to. The Techtonic drivers have IMHO two failures. They are very inefficient, 82 dB/1watt/meter at best and they disperse over 180 degrees. Optimal in a 16 X 30 foot room is 45 to 60 degrees. Wide dispersion increases room interaction corrupting the image. Wide dispersion speakers add energy from the room at 3-4kHz increasing sibilance. Some sibilance is due to bad recording but most is due to the room! Recordings of female voices and violins I once thought were bad turned out to be fine when I switched to directional speakers. 


asvjerry's avatar
asvjerry
4,586 posts
 
Agreed, DMLs' are not efficient....noting that Techtonics' PL-12 panels can coast @ 350 RMS whereas the ribbon is one-sixth of that.
DML's are noted for the wide dispersion, and a 'horn loaded' ribbon would mate well with that.
A Tech rep @ NAMM '16 ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w91Vfp8bp0 ) claims 'no room interaction', but I'll assume he's referring to a 'large room', if not a hall. *L*
They're certainly not like any 'Maggie' one might compare them to....;)

An early reference to Mangers' details a 'back to back' arrangement;  my 'seat of the pant's' observation would indicate that the large magnet's would defeat any useful dipole radiation....mho, for what it's worth...

(That, and a dollar might get one a cross-town bus tix....*G*)

'16x30'....Is that 'w x d', or the reverse?  I've typically lived in the 'd x w' situation, which certainly effects my experience of things audio...that, and 'age-related high end roll-off' which is basically inevitable. ;)
mijostyn's avatar
mijostyn OP
8,570 posts
 
@asvjerry , age sucks. And the Mangers do have a very large motor behind the membrane or whatever it is. I'm leaning towards the Fostex driver. It looks well made and is relatively inexpensive. If this approach works out well I might go to a more expensive driver but you can forget about $59K. 
16 X 30 would be w x d, speakers on the 16 foot wall with a listening position mid way in the room. 45 degrees will cover wall to wall at that distance putting the primary reflection to the side of the listener out of harms way. 


larryi
3,962 posts
 
It has been a long time since I've heard the Manger driver.  I liked its very fast attack and clean sound (very dynamic), but, it was a touch "hard" sounding.  Still, it is a very promising driver.  I heard it both with a woofer and as a single driver; it works better with a woofer.

My favorite implementation of a single driver is a quarter wave back loaded horn.  I've heard both a Voxativ and AER driver is the Charney Audio Companion speaker which is built that way, and both drivers were very good (I preferred the AER for its better top end extension).  I have heard some larger full range drivers (12" and 13") and I like them when a tweeter is added on top (the big driver being driven full range while a tweeter protected by a 1st order high pass crossover comes in way on top.  
mijostyn's avatar
mijostyn OP
8,570 posts
 
@larryi , I never heard of AER either. The BD 3 is quite a driver judging by their specs. 106 dB/watt/meter is pretty sick. Take the low bass out of it and you could probably drive it with a 12AX7. $8000/pr is on the steep side though. It seems the Germans really like full range speakers.
I am not crazy about horn loading them. I would prefer crossing to a sub at 100 Hz which will lower distortion and increase overhead. The difference in efficiency can be managed with an input level control on the sub amplifier. The 15 Class A watts you would get out of the Pass Amp Camp amp would make a 777 sound quiet. 
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