Line stage means no phono section. While the line stage Suprateks are excellent preamps, IMHO, the phono stage is where they really shine.
Preamp Deal of the Century
If anyone is looking for a true "World Class" preamp at a very fair price..heed my advice. I just recieved a Supratek Syrah preamp that was hand built by Mick Maloney in Western Australia, and it is absolutely beautiful! This preamp is the best deal you will ever find. I would put it up against any preamp out there for both looks and sound. Price? $2500 for the Syrah (includes Killer Phono stage). Not into phono? Try the Chardonney line stage for $2100. Don't get me wrong, I am not associated with this company. I am just a very happy owner! This preamp is VERY dynamic, yet liquid. It conveys the sound of music better than any other preamp that I have ever heard! You can check out the Supratek website at www. cantech.net.au
Showing 41 responses by jphii
Well, after reading this thread many times, I finally bought a Syrah. It will be here on Tuesday. I got the one listed here with the copper top & covers (Thanks Vade!). I can't wait to get it started in my system. Being way biased toward vinyl, I can't wait to hear it played without a step up tranny. One less signal path! So, I guess I just wanted to let all of the other owners out there know to get ready for more dumb questions! Don't worry, I've read the thread enought to keep away from things already covered. But, I'm shure I'll figure out something no one has come across, and need a little help. I'll let you know how it matches with the rest of my system. Joe's Teres Thanks |
Tim, I just got my Syrah, second hand. In the past week I've tried about 20 different tubes, 3 power cords, 5 pairs of ic's, and 2 amps. The sovtek 5881's are not that bad, but I deiced to go with JJ's for now. I didn't want to pull the Tung Sols out of my amp, but that's next. The Mullard rectifier is the only way to go. I like the rca grey glass black base 6sn7gt. And, even thought my system is primarily analog, I'm using the stock phono tubes. They actually sound quite good (not really!). Today is the day I roll phono tubes, I'll let ya know. I started with the cord supplied, went to a silver one, then a Zu. I like the Zu. Now this is where in gets interesting. Since the only ic's are from the pre to the amp, it was easy too. CD doesn't count. They are not made for serious listening IMHO. Started off with one of those $2000 retail here at auction, that you can get for $200 gold/silver/copper/best you ever heard ic's. Sounded like shit. Went to a low dollar (under 100) pair. Sounded about 5 times better. Kept playing around. Now, I happened to have a set of Zu component video cables, extra's from the HT. I feel that's the best video cable you cab buy, so I says "self, lets try it" Wow, works like a charm, and will stay. $75! Any flak I get for this, all I can say is; It works for me, in MY system. Another wierd one. My Belles 150 sounds better than the Audio Note Soro SE. I cannot figure this out, because I use AN speakers, AN cd, and AN speaker cables. So, I might have done something wrong here. It may have to do with the way you have to wire the Soro, because it's not made to be used as a stand-alone amp. I will be playing with this further, and trying to get some help on this board too. So, I guess my point is, all of the set-up ideas given in this thread are fine, but may not work in YOUR system. I spent a lot of money on a NOS pair of Ken-Rad black glass VT231, and I like the RCA's Better, IN MY SYSTEM. So, take it all with grain of salt, try a few different things, and have some fun! BTW, I forgot about the 3 pairs of speaker cables, the AN won hands down. Joe |
One more thing. Am I the only one who has 6c45pi-E phono tubes? There is one post about 6c45n, but that's it. I have 4 NOS Russian military replacements. But, what else can I use? I have done quite a bit of research, and have found SOME data on this tube, but not much. Will the 417a work? 5842? Any of the myriad 12ax7's? Somebody help! Joe |
Slowhand, Thanks, I'm was having a hard time finding something I could roll. I had a feeling...but I'm no expert on tube substitutions. I just wanted to know my options. So far, the Syrah is everything it's cracked up to be. Sounds so much better than the pre stage in my Soro. Still playing with tubes. So far I'm running: Tung sol 5881 & Mullard gz34 in the psu Nos 6c45pi-e & RCA gray glass in the pre. Still have a few more tubes on hand to try. I still need to figure out a way to run the Syrah through the Soro without going through the tape loop. Two volume controls is a pain in the a@#. Oh well, it's either that or the Belles 150. Time to sell some kit and get some new tube monos! I'll keep all informed. |
Cello, I know what you mean, but nobody has covered the 6c45pi-e, period. I read EVERY post on this thread several times. There seems to have been a tube-rolling thread, but it's disappeared. Until Slowhand let me know about possible alternatives, I was shooting in the dark. I guess that's half the fun of having a custom built preamp. Even Mick told me there was no alternatives to the Russian tube! That's why we gotta keep asking. |
Larry, Do you know what tubes Mick is using in your phono stage? If he uses an oddball tube like the 6c45pi, you are going to be very limited as to what you can use. And to top it all of, the damn things are expensive! Well over $100 for a quad. As soon as I find a decent quad, I'll get them broken in and let you know how they sound. Look here, and you'll see what I mean about tubes: NOS/NIB* 1958 Western Electric JW-5842/417A tubes/tube For now, the NOS Russian's are actually sounding quite nice. For something using such a high mu triode in the phono stage, the noise floor is incredibly low. It has brought out the details I could not hear before. Things like .2 g off on VTF, incorrect speaker placement and cable choices all have an audible effect now. Ah, the saga continues.... |
Larry, Oops, I forgot, TT on the way, Supratek in hand. I know there are a ton of choices for the 6922, but that Russian stuff is hard to figure. Not being a tube expert, I think that the 6c45n-e is a hi mu triode like the pi-e in mine. I actually think it is the same tube, because the n actually represents pi, in cyrillic. Look here: TDSL Cyrillic characters That is my favorite tube data site. It will let you know what is an exact match and what is close, and a ton of other data. I know that I use Amperex Bugle Boy 6dj8's for 6922 in the AN and in my CD player. I seems to work well for me. But you have a lot of choices, and a lot of them are not too ridiculously priced. Look at the 6922 thread here. Joe |
OK all, I won a quad of Raytheon "windmill" black plate 5842's yesterday on ebay. Look here: Raytheon 5842 So, now I have a third set to try in the Syrah. I hope these offer considerable performance over the 6c45pi-e. I'm not going to spend $200+ for a quad of WE417a. I just hope it was worth it. Let you know after I get a chance to run them in for a while. Joe |
Larry, I can tell you one thing: If you have the 6c45 tube, you're stuck with it. I tried the 5842's, and they don't work. I need to research tube specs to find something that I can sub for the Russian tube. On the other hand, if I keep the gain switch on low I have all of the volume I need (which can sometimes be quite a bit) with no tube noise at all. They get a little microphonic with the gain set to high at higher lisening levels. I think it is a very good tube, but I wish I had some more choices. It is fun using tubes as "tone controls" and different sounds. I had all kinds of fun when I was playing around with the 12ax7's in the Audio Note. I'll keep looking, and let you know.... |
I emailed someone who is considerably more tube savvy than I, and he said; "6C45P is unique. There is no replacement whatsoever." So, it looks like i bought the 5842's for nothing. They DID NOT WORK in the Syrah. I also emailed Mick, "who ought to know" and he said the same thing. No big deal, because they do sound excellent. Just wish I had some options! |
1 rectifier, 2 power, 2 line stage. But, don't screw with the tubes until you get about a hundred hours on it. That way, you can try the tubes one at a time after you get it broken in a little. That's the only way you will be able to tell what works for you in your system. Welcome to the Supratek club! As always, you only need to look through this thread to find the answer to any question you might have. If it's not here, ask and you shall be answered. |
Larry, Check here for the 6c45pi: About 2/3 down the page $40 for a matched pair. They call it the Commie equivilent of the WE 437a. Me thinks not, and I'm not going to spend a hundred bucks to find out. Remember, I need 4 in my Syrah. I still feel there is nothing wrong with that tube. After quite a lot of play, I can still find NOTHING wrong with the phono stage! I have a matched quad and a matched pair of NOS 5842's that I have to get rid of because of some bad info about interchangability, so be careful if anyone tells you different. Also, I'll answer you email after I check my calendar. Joe |
Try Brasso, it's readily available. Or, the absolute best polish for metal or any finish for that matter is made by Rolite. The type AP-300 Aircraft Aluminum Polish is unbelievable! The trouble is it is very hard to find, and hideously expensive. The bright side (no pun) is that one container will last you a lifetime, at least until you figure out that it works on cars, boats, motorcycles, etc.... I use it on all of the above, plus any metal that I want to shine. They make a polish & sealant that nees to be used after it on paint, plexi, or acrylic, and you have to use this to seal the finish! Very important, but only for paint & plastics. The metal finishes in the house should never need it. Now, not affiliated, just like it. |
Abe, You didn't get the last pair, I just got 4 more! He said they were used, but 3 test NOS. Just no boxes. The other set test ok, but one has some rattles. So I'm set for life. Mondie & Slipknot, I hope you don't have big plans for T-day. It sounds like you may be spending the day enjoying your new toys with your turkey. I can't wait to hear what you think of the PX4. Happy Thanksgiving!! Joe |
Ok, a bit of a strange question. Does the Syrah PS only have a rectifier, or the rectifier/regulator combo? Every picture I've seen shows only the rectifier. Mine has all three, like the Cortese. But, Grannyring posted under Bwhite's system: I just purchased Syrah pre with the same power supply as the Cortese - one of a kind according to Supratek. So, what tube configuration does your PS have? I thought I'd get a little more info before I emailed Mick, and held up production for those of you waiting for your units! |
I still haven't had a chance to get some pics up, but I did email Mick about my tube layout. I said: I bought Syrah serial #119 about a year ago. I have a question. All of the Syrahs I see on Audiogon & Audio Asylum have only the rectifier in the power supply. Mine has both the regulators & rectifier on the power supply. Was this an unusual configuration? #119 was built in July 2001, as per your initials on the bottom of the PS. It is Jarrah & copper. I am hoping you can tell me whats up with mine. He replied: Hi Joe I guess I made out a lot better than I thought I did! All I know is: This piece brings me almost as much enjoyment as my Teres. And since it helps me enjoy my Teres even more, it will be here for a long time. Now, if you people would stop killing me with the WE350b's on ebay, I'd REALLY be happy! Joe |
A little follow-up on my email from Mick. I was looking at systems today, and I took a quick look at Bwhite's. I wanted to see his Cortese agin, to compare it to my "Syrah". Damn if mine doesn't look exactly like his! Except for the tubes, it's a dead ringer. I think I'm going to start calling mine the SyrTese. And I'n still trying to win the damn 350b's. |
Finally! I finally won a set of WE350b's! Now I can see for myself what some of you have been saying about this tube. The last 2 sets on ebay went for $550 & $650, and they are about $800 at Tubeworld, so I feel lucky to have gotten them for FAR less than that. After I get used to them I'll add my opinion to the thread. Joe |
Well guys, a little bad news. The WE 350b's came today, and shit, one's screwed. So much for that. At least the seller indicated in his ad that he offered money-back if something was wrong with them. I'm going to take them and get them checked before I send them back, just to be sure. This sucks. The only good thing that happened because of it was that I tried some of my other 6l6 tubes. I put in a set of NOS Sylvania Jan 6l6wgb's, and they sound better than the Tungsols. Go figure.... |
They are round plates. I actualy got them on ebay, and he has more, buy it now only, at $15 each. Here is the link to the ad: Ebay 6F6G His name is David. He has eight left, of different brands. I should have bought all of the ST shaped tubes, but I wasn't thinking. At least he won't jack up the price, so others can get this deal, well, at least 8 more tubes! Hope this helps. Joe |
Quick question: Are Cello and I the only ones with the 6c45pi tube in the phono stage? Vade was kind enough to email a link for new Reflektors, but the seller is in Europe, and his minimum order is $140. That's 13 tubes. SO' I'll make the order if there are some of you who can use them. They can't be much more than $13 including shipping. I need four, so that's 9 up for grabs. Enough interest and I'll order on Monday, 15 Nov. Joe |
One more thing. I got my NOS, NIB Sylvania 6F6G's yesterday. After leaving the SyrTese on for a couple of hours while we went out for oysters, it was time for some serious listening and drinking. The system was ready after leaving one of those little silver things on repeat. While the women bitched about the volume, a friend who has spent quite a lot of time listening to my system said: "What the hell's up? It didn't sound like this last week." He didn't even notice those big old fat bottle tubes in the PS. All he knew in his decidedly non-audiophool way was: "Man, that's the cat's ass! It sounds great!" And that was even with an album I'm not particularly impressed with. When I whipped out the old classic MOFI DSOTM, he about wet himself! Suffice it to sat that I am EXTREMELY impressed with this tube. David, I cannot thank you enough for the reccomendation. I can say now that I will not be looking for another set of WE350b's. I was more amazed than my buddy. Now we all know there are some truly exceptional tubes that make a Supratek come alive, and this is one of them. And only $35! Compared to 6-8 hundred for the WE's? If you can find a set, try them. Far and away the best tube improvement I've heard so far. And that's after 4 hours of listening. I can't wait for them to really open up. |
Bill, I use the Supratek with AN gear. I have a Soro SE Phono, which is the M1 with a P2SE in one box. It does have a few mods. I also use AN speakers, CD player and some AN cables (I constantly switch, AN and others), both silver and copper. While my Teres is a little better than you MMF, your amps kill mine. I've heard them, and if I could afford them.... Between the tubes I'm using and the mods there is not much difference on the pre side. So, what I am trying to say is it is a very good mix, the Supratek and Audio Note. I too would have the M6, but 7 grand used I can't swing. Not having heard the Audio Valve I can't offer a comparison there, but I REALLY like the Supratek. Mine is an oddball one, I call it the SyrTese. I may have the only Syrah with the Cortese power supply. To quote Mick "I did some neat things with that one." The only thing that would possibly knock the SyrTese out of my system would be building an Audio Note Signature pre kit. Based on the M7, but upgraded heavily, it may be one of the best values out there. But for now, all I can say is from my experience, the Supratek works VERY well with Audio Note gear. Give it a shot. If you can find one used, one thing you don't have to worry about is losing money on it if you don't like it. |
Hi Bill, Just checked in and saw your post. Thanks. I know the M2 is better than the M1, but I didn't think there was that much difference. Now the M3 was another story. Remember, it could just be my ears. But I think the Supratek is better. I'd go with the Supratek over an M3, because as noted ad nauseum, the phono stage is SO GOOD. For vinyl, and digital from what I've read (not being a big digital fan I really don't care, so I can't comment on that aspect of it) I'd go with the Sauvignon in a minute. I'd bet he phono stage is that much better than the Audion, but again, I have not heard it so can't really comment. Now remember, I am a BIG FAN of AN products. So that means I have some sad news. I have decided to sell my SyrTese. I need the funds to finance building a set of AN Kit 3 speakers and I can live without a seperate pre while I get it done. Wc65mustang said it very well: You only live once I suppose but we all live on budgets. One of the features that comes with Mick's preamps is they will sell quickly and without much $$$$$ loss, if any, should you need to move it This was a tough decision, and mainly a financial one becuse I am on a budget. If my wife knew what some of this stuff cost.... I've been wanting to upgrade my speakers for a long time now. I guess I made the decision based on my experiences with Audio Note. I really like AN gear, even at the level I have and want to go to a higher-end all AN system. Since I want to go higher on the AN level system, I've been kind of stuck cause I can't afford 8 grand for a used set of E/SEC that show up occasionally here. So I've been talking with Brian at AN Kits and then this showed up: Nico's Kit 3's Talk about timing. Brian told me last week he would have the Kt 3's in stock in early Feb. So that's my next project. But the only way I can do it is to sell the Supratek. And I am going to miss it! |
One thing you guys have to remember is that there are Suprateks out there that use other tubes in the phono stage. Mine is one, it uses only 6c45pi. Cello's is another, his uses (correct me if I am wrong Larry) 2 6c45pi and 2 6922. The 6c45pi are not part of the 417a/5842 family, regardless of what anyone says. I guess it proves that any Supratek is truly a custom piece. I have not heard of any 2 that are exactly the same. So I guess what I am saying is you cannot look at tube topology to identify a model. Everybody says that the Syrah only has one tube in the ps. Wrong! Joe |
