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  3. 1345927301

Selling dispute. Please comment.

I recently sold a pair of mono amps and checked the box that indicated the original manual was included. I never use the manual for something like this and just assumed the manual was in the box as there were some various papers from the manufacturer in the boxes.

The buyer got the amps safely and they are in perfect condition as described. I shipped the same day the item sold. Unfortunately the manuals were not in the boxes the amps came in. These were the original boxes, but the manuals are not there according to the buyer.

I sent him the link to download the pdf of the manual. He is not happy with that. I offered to print a color double sided copy (on good stock) at Kinkos for $20 (at my expense) and ship that to him. He says that the original manual was promised and that I have to deliver that to him. And that he dervers two of them since the amps came in two separate boxes. He is threating to kill the deal and dispute with audiogon and paypal.

I admit that I'm in the wrong for mis-stating that the manuals were included. I will attempt to order the manuals from the manufacturer on Monday, but I don't know that the manufacturer will provide them even if I pay for them.

I'd appreciate comments regarding this problem. Thank you.
jaxwired
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drubin
3,274 posts
 
You didn't say who the amp manufacturer is. There are some that produce nicely-printed manuals, but many others for which the PDF you'd print at home is as good OR BETTER than what ships new.
markpao
519 posts
 

A lot of good points made here. I want to add the risk involving shipping these back to the seller. I'm assuming these amps are heavy, and we all know how UPS & Fedex love to damage heavy items.
IMO, this matter could get a lot worse just because of a missing owners manual.
trelja
3,223 posts
 
Lloydc, "No other lawyers here? Seller substantially performed, so Buyer has no right to reneg or undo the deal after delivery. Damages are calculated based on the financial loss the Buyer incurred due to Seller's inadvertant misrepresentation, which in this case, are trivial, or the difference in price between the value of the item as represented and the value of the item as delivered, which again, is a trivial difference. This is not the same case as a unique antique or collectable, where specific performance can be the applicable standard."

I've never considered myself a fan of lawyers, but I find your post the paragon of both reason and common sense.
polk432
1,142 posts
 
CAREFUL! If the unit was paid through Paypal using a CC the buyer can demand a chargeback. Not as described. I hate to hear about things happening like this, but I think the buyer simply changed his mind. Did he sign for the package? That may be the sellers way out, but even if it is, the seller should do all he can to make it right and get the original manuals into the buyers hands.
almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
Lloyd & Joe (Trelja), your points are of course well taken. But being on solid ground legally, as well as morally and by any other reasonable measure, doesn't necessarily equate to a practical solution.

In this case, the buyer is threatening to "kill the deal and dispute with audiogon and paypal." At best, that would lead to a lot of hassle and wasted time. At worst, it would lead to a charge-back, and possibly to the items being received back in damaged condition (as Mark rightly pointed out). And with the buyer being the party to whom the shipping service is contractually obligated, in terms of a possible insurance settlement! Which is why I said that as a practical matter Jaxwired is essentially stuck with having to negotiate, no matter how rightful his position may be.

Regards,
-- Al
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