SL1200GAE New Tonearm
DeaR @billstevenson : yOU CAN TRY THIS, IT WILL MAKE THAT YOU EXPERIENCE AS YOU WERE LISTENING A NEW AND DIFFERENT TONEARM A WAY BETTER ONE: https://www.audiyo.com/kits/tonearm-rewire-kit/rewire-kit.html R. |
Dear @billstevenson : Good that you like it because Technics usually does not make mistakes of that tonearm caliber where other say to change the stock arm.. Problem is that atmasphere is a seller and always post to promote something of his busine$$. I hope @jtsnead could talk with you about. He really needs help not some one trying to " spend " his money. Anyway, other than those headshells you are using did you rewired the tonearm internally?. Could be a " significant " up-grade specially with that great Windfeld cartridge you own. Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS, R. |
I agree that the stock arm on the GAE is outstanding. I have not compared it with a Triplanar, but have an SME on another TT, and a VPI 3D w/dual pivot on another and compared to them it is easier to set up and sounds as good as or better than the others all things considered. In terms of headshells, I use the Zupreme and more recently have found the Yamamoto HS-4S carbon to be even better. Actually a lot better. Both have azimuth adjustment and weigh a reasonable 12 g or so. My favorite of several cartridges is an Ortofon Windfeld and my preferred phono preamp is a Conrad-Johnson TEA2MAX with a Bob's SUT. |
Ralph, congratulations for that. I knew it was some time ago you established Atma-Sphere, but at my age narrowing down specifics for time is not always easy. I will only add that nearly 30 years ago I owned a pair of your MA-1 amps, 100 wpc as I recall. Within their limitations they were one of the most musically enjoyable components I ever had. Unfortunately because of the power requirements for my speakers and their impedance curve it was not a good match for complex, dynamic music. Otherwise the amps themselves were amazing and your support was exceptional. I remain impressed to this day. Now back to tonearms. ;^) |
Cannot see how it can get much better and I have heard some great tonearms.As I have mentioned, the stock arm is as good or better than many 'high end audio' arms. It could be playing bass better though and could be a bit more neutral (the arm tube talks back to the cartridge a bit). @pryso FWIW, Atma-Sphere was established 42 years ago as of August of this year. |
Dear @pryso : How you doing, I hope everything is fine with you and your family. Look, I understand your point but in reality that's not the main subject of my latest post to him. He is an expert with tube design. I said it's a roockie on overall tonearm design because I belive in this and that he choosed to make his busine$$ through the TP speaks about. I'm not against him as a fact I'm not against any one inside or outside the audio world. You know me and know I'm not that kind of person. Your post appreciated. R. |
raul, I must say I'm disappointed by your reference to Ralph as a rookie. You and I met some years ago and I have great respect for your audio knowledge and that in person you impress as a real gentleman. But some of your replies here seem quite condescending. Ralph can speak for himself but he has been in the audio business more than 30 years I believe. He may not design and build tonearms but he has the experience of utilizing a number of arms in the tables he builds and modifications he offers. That is not a basis for being labeled a rookie. He prefers the design of the TP arms, you do not. One thing I've learned in decades of participation in this hobby, there are no absolute answers. |
@jtsnead : Obviously can and that's why he did it and that's why I gave mine and you and other gentlemans gave their own. We are in a free world and I'm not saying I can't be wrong and I always am willing to learn from you or every one. I did not tell you stay away from TP, I only gave my opinion why this time is better stay away from any tonearm change saving money for other better time in the near future but as I said it I don't care what you decide about because it's not my money and it's not me whom have to live with. I'm sorry to disturb you through my posts, Ionly try to help. R. |
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Yes, maybe I can be more mind-calm with out removable headshell additional connection joints but this is not the whole history as it’s not what the you say about the bearing plane where it’s extremely important for unipivots but with the solid Technics tonearms that is BS.Its simple. The bearing *style* isn't the issue. Think about two people carrying a couch. On level ground, they both carry the same weight. Going up stairs, the one on the bottom carries more. If the tone arm has the bearings in the plane of the LP, the weight on teh stylus remains pretty constant with bass and warp. But if the bearing is higher, the tracking force diminishes faster with bass and warp. This is easy to prove out with geometry and is why arms like the Triplanar, SME 5 and ET are set up that way. Some arms (like the old Fidelity Research) attempt to solve this by designing the counterweight to hang below the arm tube (which the Technics does not do, but would be an improvement for that arm) but this is not as effective as placing the bearings in the right place to begin with. |
Dear @atmasphere : " But both the Triplanar and the some of the SMEs have something on the Technics arm, which is that the bearings are in the plane of the LP rather than the arm tube. This allows for more consistent tracking force in bass passages and negotiating warp. It makes a difference as to how well the arm can play bass. The Triplanar is far more adjustable, and has much harder bearings; VTA can be adjusted on the fly, and the arm tube is damped for less coloration. A removable headshell means that there are more mechanical connections, which can degrade the sound when dealing with very small signal levels. That is why the SMEs and the Triplanar do not have a removable headshell. " All that is what we learned but that never no one proved in a scientific way: with facts out of the theory. Something as myths. Yes, maybe I can be more mind-calm with out removable headshell additional connection joints but this is not the whole history as it’s not what the you say about the bearing plane where it’s extremely important for unipivots but with the solid Technics tonearms that is BS. Are you trying to terrorize the OP and other gentlemans only because you has a very close relationship with TP? I can proved " face to face " in your own system that a removable headshell tonearm design outperforms the TP everything the same. Always is the same problem with you: you are biased $$$$ in comercial way and you don’t post as a true audiophile where your only interest is to hel given a unbiased advise a non-comercial one. You can help to your customers but your latest post here is part of that corrupted AHEE where we all belongs but you are in the darker side. Why not let the people to learn, the OP money is and comes from him IT IS NOT YOUR MONEY and your adviise has no true and real foundations. It's very easy to " spend " the money of other person. @jtsnead you already own as five cartridges and now suddenly you posted: " comes down to once you find the cartridge you’d like your tend to just use that 1 anyway. " Don’t tell me: in which planet because that almost never happens in our audio world. Do what you want it, I really don’t care. My opinuion was and is for you can use your money ( not mine. ) in the best way and that for me is not that TP or SME change. But this is me. Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS, R. |
Read my mind atmosphere it is good that it's reversible stock arm is very good I just always liked the look of the Tri planar thinking about the are board from you atmosphere stay tune I will miss removable head shells but the comes down to once you find the cartridge you'd like your tend to just use that 1 anyway |
Ralph, So sorry that I volunteered you for TP questions. That was unfair of me. (I think maybe that was why you wrote, "sheesh".)No, it wasn't, and no worries. would like not to drill into the plinth though. The arm I got is from John I think you know him.@jtsnead , there's no need for that- if done correctly, its all reversible with no evidence it ever happened. " Want to change the stock arm. ", what's wrong with. What do you do not like? The stock arm is competitive with many high end arms. But both the Triplanar and the some of the SMEs have something on the Technics arm, which is that the bearings are in the plane of the LP rather than the arm tube. This allows for more consistent tracking force in bass passages and negotiating warp. It makes a difference as to how well the arm can play bass. The Triplanar is far more adjustable, and has much harder bearings; VTA can be adjusted on the fly, and the arm tube is damped for less coloration. A removable headshell means that there are more mechanical connections, which can degrade the sound when dealing with very small signal levels. That is why the SMEs and the Triplanar do not have a removable headshell. |
Dear @jtsnead : " Want to change the stock arm. ", what's wrong with. What do you do not like? The gimball bearing on the Technics arms is really very good design and your GAE tonearm is made from magnesium that's similar on some of the top SME build material. Been a removable headshell design is really an advantage because you can match your tonearm to any cartridge out there That the TP or other tonearms just can't do it no matter what. ) only by making changes in the headshell characteristics: different build material, different shapes, different weigth, different headshell wires, etc, etc. In the other side if you want it something better you can do it through the headshells and changing the tonearm internal wiring with out to change the tonearm or invest 3.5K that you can save for other items as could be a better mat and clamp or damping footers and obviously buying more LP´s. You have several options before you can really feel the necessity to change the tonearm. Only an opinion. Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS, R. |
Sheesh. OK, we've done several SL1200G (or GAE) machines so far. Both the Triplanar 12" and the 9.5" arms can be mounted. I recommend replacement of the platter pad as well. We fabricate a special armboard; the concern is that the rigidity of the plinth and subchassis must be as rigid and dead as possible, so that if the platter is vibrating in some plane, the arm is also moving in that same plane so the noise cannot be transduced (the principle behind our model 208 turntable as well). Most of the armboards I've seen aftermarket don't address this issue and so might have a bit of coloration. The finished combination is spectacular. Technics really did their homework on the new SL1200. |
You might ask Ralph Karsten (Atma-sphere) whether the standard 9-inch Triplanar will mount on the new SL1200GAE. If it does, very good choice. A 12-inch version of the TP is now available, as well. I own both a 10.5-inch Reed 2A and a 9-inch TP. Both are excellent, but I know for sure that the 9-inch TP will not mount on an SP10 Mk2 or Mk3, which is why I bought the 10.5-inch Reed. However, this was before the 12-inch TP came into existence. |
@jtsnead Never tried the ART-9, but this is my old ART-2000 on Reed 3P "12 "9.5 Reed is much cheaper than "12 inch, i hope you can get one in your price range. Here is a picture of short Reed arms from ArtisanFidelity |
@johnnyb53 When Technics introduced the SL1200, they also introduced the SL120, which--instead of including a Technics tonearm--included a SME-compatible armboard. It was in 1975-1977, but good idea. New SL-1200GAE, G, RG series without technics tonearm would be great today. Anyway we will see NEW Technics tonearms for sale from those people who will replace them with something else. I think the owners of old Sl1200mkII could replace their stock old tonearm with this new arm from GAE series. I wonder how much |
@chakster also looking at the reeds, know anyone can get me one near my price.as I read more not sure about the TP I do like how the arm sits on the top of the table like the red. I know about the arm boards I was almost going to order the Jelco 850S from them but thought might as go up a notch or two. My cartridges are the Cadenza Bronze, AT ATR9. Quintet black, Grace F9 with ss ruby stylus. Could also get the Jelco and upgrade my Parasound JC3 JR phono stage? |
Yes looking at a V would like easy vta not sure how easy sme are SME armboards for SL1200GAE, G, and GR When Technics introduced the SL1200, they also introduced the SL120, which--instead of including a Technics tonearm--included a SME-compatible armboard. The Technics DD TTs have a relationship with SME tonearms going back to the product introduction. |
I would recommend Reed tonearms, if you will check for 9,5" inch versions the pivot to spindle distance is 223mm, all you need is 3 holes to screw in the tonearm to the armboard, but the cable will stay above the armboard. Reed 3P, among other features, like fine VTA adjustment on-the-fly, also has a unique possibility of adjusting azimuth while playing a record. An exciting thing about the azimuth adjuster is that during the adjustment process the cartridge "swings" around the needle tip, hence keeping all other tonearm parameters intact. Reed 3p 12" Cocobolo is my reference tonearm, but there are more options from Reed. Many options for the material of the armtube available, so it’s eary to chose the mass for your cartridge. Absolutely amazing build quality. Not only VTA on the fly, but also Azimuth on the fly! With this tonearm you can properly adjust ultra High-End cartridges. And BTW this is a good looking removable armboard for your GAE https://theaudiophileman.com/sound-vision-2018-ammonite-audio/ |
