SL1200GAE New Tonearm

did you position the arm on Norberts table just so the wire would miss the hinge? I was wondering about why the arm is shifted to the left so much?

If I recall correctly we made the arm board for his machine but Tri of Triplanar actually did the mounting and setup.

Dear @jtsnead : If the tonearm shifted to the left it's because the the tonearm cable is out of position.

With out the antiskating mechanism and zero VTF ( leveled horizontal. ) a tonearm must stays steady where you left  its position, if not then there exist a problem.

R.

Yes it shuts. @atmashere did you position the arm on Norberts table just so the wire would miss the hinge? I was wondering about why the arm is shifted to the left so much?

If you position the arm correctly, yes, you can use the lid. You can't do it with the 12" though :)

can you still use the lid with that arm?

Absolutely beautiful Jerry. I will have to come by one day to hear it.

Lance

Nicely done, Jerry!

nice job.  beautiful.

@jtsnead 

Finally got it done

https://photos.app.goo.gl/WE2NLEe5mW5QtMuk7  

That's a good looking turntable now :) 

I did the mod not hard at all. Bought the board off of ebay and drilled it myself. I like the Funk Firm mats that is what I am using. Weights, clamps do not make much of a difference but I really have not tried to compare with and without, The VPI weight I just put on for the pictures

Jerry,

Congratulations !!  I know it sounds great !!   Looks good too !!

Who did the mod ? The armboard ? Have you tried different mats yet? How about record weights ? Did you use it stock for awhile and run the motor in ?

I believe that you are the 5th person to mod the Technics w/ Triplanar. I know Ralph has done 4 mods including mine.

Finally got it done

https://photos.app.goo.gl/WE2NLEe5mW5QtMuk7

@johnnyb53  Where did you hear that the arm is "aluminum with a magnesium coated finish"?  Everything I have seen says it is magnesium, including the Technics website.

tzh21y:

one of my questions regarding the Technics arm is how were they able to bend it? It is magnesium?

The tonearm is made of aluminum with a magnesium coated finish.

one of my questions regarding the Technics arm is how were they able to bend it?  It is magnesium?

Same here. Long breakin but well worth it.

That is about right, mine opened up became more musically solid after couple hundred hours

I just had an experience with the 1200G which, IMHO, has to do with the internal tonearm wires.  I have had my table for about 4 months and after considerable listening, the sound just opened up immensely.  It was very good before this happened.  Now it sounds simply incredible.  I bet its the wires in the tonearm.  They must take a long time to run in.  very deep and accurate bass and the sound just relaxed a bit.  This with a Lyra Delos.  

Dear Raul, I am waiting for you to back up your claim that placing the tonearm bearing in the plane of the LP is a good idea only for gimbal type tonearms, not for unipivots.  Please do explain why a unipivot would not benefit from such a design element.  Moreover, these days there are almost no pure unipivots left on the market.  Nearly all unipivot-like tonearms are now employing secondary bearings to stabilize the unipivot.  How would you treat this third category?  Thanks.

I love my Thales Simplicity II with my SP10mk3. 

This coupled with the Lyra Atlas SL is sublime.

The Delos has a more forward presentation as well

JTSnead-  the best cartridge for synergy with this table was the Ortofon Bronze.  The Delos is great as well, needs many hours of run in.  The Bronze was very good.  The Delos just tracks so amazingly that it is hard to take off of the table.  Patience is a virtue with it as it takes a long time to run in.  At least my copy did.  It does not hurt from time to time to use the demagnetizer.

jtsnead- I am using the ortofon LH4000 with the Delos. I am using the headshell wires that came with the LH6000 and also a Orsonic 200 gram record Clamp  With the Glider, I am using a Jelco HS-25 and with the Grace the Stock headshell

All I have to say is I cannot believe this arm came for free with this table. It is truly a very good arm.

Dear @invictus005: """  Just because the tonearm cable is copper, it doesn't mean that the silver tonearm wire portion will not have a positive impact. From my experience, it has a very big impact.

I use silver plated van den Hul ......................................................

I don't use silver anywhere else in the system as it becomes overwhelmingly too much....................."""

you are spot on about silver wires/cables and only ignorant persons think in different way.

Where I disagree with you is that all wired system with silver is " overwhelmingly too much ".
If that happens in any audio system then there are some " faults " in one or some of the audio system chain links but the silver wires.
When you have a better signal conductor over your system all the " trash " comes out.

In my system I use only silver wires/cables ( I re-wire the inside wires in my speakers too. )including in the power cables. Outstanding resolution ! ! !

That's why I recomended to do it to @b

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

unfortunatelly my dialogue with atmasphere was and is from a way different subject.

That is true - mostly an apparent lack of decorum on Raul's part.

hone$t opinion$$?

Good for you.

R.

Dear @nkonor: I know that you did not buy it because you like it, I was refering to the OP post.

Yes, it's your money and your privilege.

When I give any advise I always analize all what's surrounded in that audio system or audio item and then share what I will do if I was in the same situation/scenario and that's why I said that makes no sense to change a very good tonearm with out been analized the different up-date alternatives as the ones I mentioned that with out doubt makes the stock Technics tonearm to " swim " in the same pool as the best top today TP and maybe way better than the TP just maybe.

The stock Technics tonearm is marketed to a price point where the 1877 up-dates can't goes because that price point.

The 1877 up-date is a wire that the TP today owners only can " dream " because the one inside the TP is an inferior one and that's what you have.

But, as I said it's your money and spend it as you want it.

Like you, I always ask for more too.

R.

Dear @jcarr : """   preference either for or against universal headshell tonearms. """

unfortunatelly my dialogue with atmasphere was and is from a way different subject.

"""  although cartridge manufacturers would love for universal-headshell tonearms to become more popular (because that would encourage customers to own more cartridges), many high-quality tonearms, including those mentioned above, do not use removable headshells. """


Problem is that till today does not exist the " perfect " tonearm design, always we have to deal with trade-offs looking for the " best " trade-offs.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

jtsnead,

This Forum might be my only way to communicate today. Computer is totally down and phone is having issues too.  

I did send you photos and tried email too. I don’t know if you received??

Well said Norbert. I agree totally. As far as atmosphere having an agenda good for him i feel as long as vendors are up front and honest and truly believes in what he likes it is all good. Ralph has never tried to sell me anything he just offered his honest opinions which I listened to because he has expierennce with what I am interested in. 

I wish All here would show their conviction in their opinions and do take their own advice.

 I chased the Technics mod since Axpona 2016 when I was the Only one in the room. In minutes, I heard what the Technics could do. I looked it over, talked to the rep. I Knew that I wanted this TT; no matter the look ___ I heard SPEED control, no doubting it and what it conferred to the MUSIC. I knew from 30yrs chasing the High End grail and 45yrs chasing the grail -(15) as a poor ‘phile.

R, I chased this and researched this for 2 years. Do l want to go through all your tweaks? Multiple tonearm  re-wires, multiple headshells, you forgot the “Constant Contact” and all the critical listening. Don’t worry about My money, I will because it is mine.

 I did not buy this rig for looks; although I do like it. Fine Industrial.

SQ,  Plain and simple. A new High End TT at a Bargain price and a true Value in need of great tonearm. IMO 

Waste time and $$$ on tweaks and then buying the the real thing when you realize you could be enjoying?

Not me, I always ask for more.  

Best St to All on this Journey 

http://www.theaudiobeat.com/equipment/spiral_groove_centroid.htm

Spiral Groove embraces the same design philosophy as Ralph is espousing. "the bearing interface situated in the same horizontal plane as the stylus resting in the record groove"

https://sme.co.uk/audio/product/series-v/
Likewise with SME’s Type V (which does not use unipivots). "Carried in massive yoke on 10mm ball races. Axis at record mean level to minimise warp-wow."

And although cartridge manufacturers would love for universal-headshell tonearms to become more popular (because that would encourage customers to own more cartridges), many high-quality tonearms, including those mentioned above, do not use removable headshells.

While it is clear that the universal headshell is very convenient for changing cartridges, in terms of mechanical rigidity and the quality of the electrical contacts, it leaves something to be desired.

There are valid reasons supporting either option; there is no need for a specific agenda to be present for someone to have a preference either for or against universal headshell tonearms.

@atmasphere : Make sense? How the people started to know about change in the stock Technics tonearm for TP and that precisely you was whom made those changes?

Magic?

As I said, you are the only manufacturer that post in this forum and other non-Agon forum everything you make your busineSS when in all those forums is for audiophiles not for sellers as you.

Again, when any one of us took in count that gentlemans that are designers/manufacturers as N.Pass, M.Levinson, J.Carr, D'angostino, Hueber, etc, etc  are promoting in those kind of forums their exceptional products? when? show me. You are the only one.

You are not posting as an audiophile, you always post with an specific agenda , till today I never reported thesen kind of facts to the different forum administrators.

R.

I wish someone will put short version of the Reed 3P tonearm on new Technics. Reed is great, but probably unknown in the USA, so people always talking about TriPlanar.   

^^ If you want to say stuff, you have to make sense.
You've presented nothing in the way of argument to back your position, just personal attacks and accusations based on nothing. You need to up your game.

Dear @nkonor: "  The Technics and probably anyone of the great arms out there Will be Game Changers. "

Bad move or wrong way to go because the stock Technics GAE tonearm is a good one so the first step is not what you did it or the OP did too but to re-wire the Technics tonearm and use some other headshells not only builded with different materials and different weigth but with better headshell wires and headshell wires connectors. 

All those can be do it through 1877 as I posted to @billstevenson .

@nkonor, I know that you don't care but you never will know how good  is that Technics tonearm. 

"""  I have always like the TP arms since I first saw them years ago ..""

we don't buy audio items and especially tonearms jus " because I like it ", of course that a choice like that is each one privilege.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

@atmasphere : "   Every Triplanar we've installed on SL1200G 'tables was shipped to us by the customer. "

So Do you do for free?, BS. That's a seller here and in Venus or Jupiter.

R.

I know that the stock arm is very good. I also picked up a GAE version of this table and they sound the same. I have always like the TP arms since I first saw them years ago and the company started in my state so I have kind of followed their progression. I like the look of them and that is driving 25% of my decision. With have the G here also I could do a fairly easy swap between the stock tablle/arm and the GAE with the TP, but it will be 2 to 3 weeks.

@nkonor I pm'd you wanted some pics sent to me please if you could.

I am quite sure the Technics tonearm is good. I have listened to the stock 1200G more than a few times. 

I was the first to post on this Forum about the Technics TT and about replacing the stock arm.

 I have now done so and am Happy that I did. As Ralph states; I had the TT sent to him. He did nothing to promote the mod to me.

Final Thought; The Technics and probably anyone of the great arms out there Will be Game Changers.

 I have spoken to Bill Voss; Technics is listening. They are moving forward in the High End.

Keep your mind, eyes and ears open. More to come.

Best to All on this Journey 

Problem is that atmasphere is a seller and always post to promote something of his busine$$.

@rauliruegas I'm calling BS on this. Every Triplanar we've installed on SL1200G 'tables was shipped to us by the customer. Get your facts straight. 

@chakster I had an OEM Rega tonearm which I used for testing. Rewired it a number of times and tried most of the better know tonearm wire on the market. Cartridges used were OC9/II and ART9. I have since moved on to 2M Black and SME 309, but the results still hold true.

I have an exceptional sound memory and extensive knowledge in what to listen for. Familiarity of the system is also a key factor. I consistently prefer silver wire when it comes to anything related to phono. I see that Ortofon, SME, John Curl, and many others have also come to a similar conclusion. My preferred manufacturer of silver phono cabling is van den Hul.

As for recommending other members to modify commercial equipment, I would never do that. But upgrading the cartridge leads to Ortofon's silver LW 800 S and tonearm cable to van den Hul's D-501 Silver Hybrid would have my highest recommendation. 

I have no idea how you can compare the tonearm with one set of internal wires to the same toneam with another set of internal wires. You must have a computer memory as the rewire process could take a few hrs. Or you need multiply samples of the same tonearm to compare. Cardas copper set of 4 litz wires for tonearm is $25, Discovery wire set is very close in price (nice high quality, affordable wires for everyone). As i said no problem with stock wires in good tonearms, i think GAE is one of them.

I can compare for example Reed 3p tonearm that comes with ultra high-end cryo treated cable from cartridge pins to phono stage to some nice vintage toneam with stock internal wires, detachabe headshell and din connector in between and it is not necessary that cryo treaded ultra high-end expensive wires will make the sound of Reed more pleasant.

Much more depends on the cartridge, if the wire is good it will be the last thing i will change. I’m not gonna rewire tonearm 5 times to try different wires, but i would rather change 5 different cartridges. I think i already find nice interconnect and speaker cables made by Chris Sommovigo (Stereolab, Stereovox, and now Black Cat) this guy designed tonearm cable for Continuum Cobra tonearm.

Very good or ultra high-end tonearm cable is the last thing to bother (imo), the difference in price is huge sometimes, only if you have find your absolute reference cartridge and tonearm and everything else then it’s time to experiment with different tonearm wires. I believe we do not use bad cables and it make sence to change something if we’re not happy about the sound. But what if we’re happy about the sound?

Some audiogon members always advice to another members to change something or upgrade something before the buyer even start listening to his new turntables (GAE for example). It’s endless quest how to spend more money instead of enjoying music with a nice gear.

@chakster Cardas was the worst wire out of any I've tried, IMO. Just lazy and indistinct sounding. van den hul MCS150M is my favorite. 

Just because the tonearm cable is copper, it doesn't mean that the silver tonearm wire portion will not have a positive impact. From my experience, it has a very big impact. 

I use silver plated van den Hul 501 DIN to RCA tonearm cable, comes stock with SME. So far I haven't found anything better.

For removable cartridge leads, I've settled on Ortofon LW 800 S, which is a mixture of solid silver strands and silver plated copper. 

I don't use silver anywhere else in the system as it becomes overwhelmingly too much. I find copper to be better. 

Silver or Copper it is all depends on individual preferences, there no absolute. I've tried Silver Van Den Hul on my old EPA-100, but i use copper since that on all my tonearms. Also what's the point to use Silver inside the tonearm tube if the external cable is copper? 

Cardas or Discovery thin and flexible tonearm wires have the best value. Zu Audio Mission Phono RCA copper from ebay has amazing value. 

Also no problem with stock wire inside some nice vintage tonearms. 
  

@chakster Because silver wire makes a significant improvement on small signal level phono. 

I put a Jelco 750D on my 1210Mk5.  Decent improvement.  I also put an Origin Live Conqueror on of my 1210 Mk5g.  Waste of time.  Standard arm superior.
I like the look of the brand new Jelcos.  Visually they will fit with the iconic Technics look and I can only imagine they will be better than the older Jelcos that were decent.

If we have to rewire Technics GAE tonearm or Technics 10.5 on SL1000R then i don't know what to say ... Why shall we rewire reference tonearm from Technics made today for audiophiles  ??? 

It make sence to rewire an old SL1210mkII, but a brand new GAE ???