Talk but not walk?

"Drum set are tuned in a different way to every other instrument. It is extremely complex. Being able to get the right sound for the room or venue is an art.

The only way to learn to “tune” a drum set is to tune a drum set so many times that you train your ears to know what to adjust."

BINGO!

Hi jssmith

When it comes to listening I have learned to let the individual artist do the magic while I watch and learn. Going back to drummers for a second, as a kid I have had my hands slapped so many times when I went to tune in their room and set for him. If I knew I was doing some drums I made sure the rug closet was ready to be gone through. Many times they brought their own towels and wouldn’t let you get near the set. Love those guys! Anyway, we did a setup at a guitar shop some years ago where we brought in our PZC’s to surround the players while we handed them different guitars that they asked for (actually took two days). I wish HEA audiophiles could go through this. It was a lesson too be learned for the ages. I wish I would have kept those series of recordings.

I’m so glad that musicians have joined this thread!! Having experience in the studio "live room" and playback both is totally different from being in the audience or going to an audio trade show. There’s a completely different set of values. For one, you learn to throw out the $$$$$ myths and are able to focus on what is actually taking place musically. There are so many variables!!! Some engineers still went by the book, but it was the experienced guys who would come in and just know everything the minute they came in the space and their ears made contact with the room. Absolute geniuses. A couple of guys trained me early on with guitars, two were my cousins Doc & Merle Watson, the other was Mick Ronson. Lots of other guys added to my learning but they were the ones (oh and Phil Keaggy) who got me into those instruments. And while I’m handing out credits, the guys at Guitar Works down in Atlanta, they were great and talented.

guys

This is also why I build Tunable products. A listener might be sitting there content, and that’s cool, but think of how many people want (need) to hear the actual event in order to be satisfied? The chances of a one sound HEA system reproducing the actual sound (sounds) of a recording is far fetched at best. When I have an artist sitting in my room with my system I tune in the music to his original recollection.

This is just me personally, but I can’t even imagine how HEA has survived with only a volume control and no tunable system. My clients always tell me how they can’t see how tuning has been overlooked in this hobby. And honestly I believe the future for HEA has to include tuning, if it plans on being around much longer, but that’s me.

please read this again from Mr. Smith "Another test I found interesting was a $2,000 Mesa amp against a tiny $170 amp voiced specifically to mimic the Mesa. They sounded slightly different, but the $170 amp sounded BETTER!"

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net

The chances of a one sound HEA system reproducing the actual sound (sounds) of a recording is far fetched at best.

"The biggest choice in HEA of course is whether to select a guru or be your own."

My experience has been all the above. Attitudes and egos aside, there's that musical uniqueness to everyone. Some you have to look harder (that's a drag) but most have their values because of what they have either experienced or what they have read. Both have a value and there are all levels of knowledge.

for example, reading a reviewer from a magazine

For some this gives a certain level of info, measurements and comfort. For myself it's a door opener only, an infomercial. First thing I do, since I have learned about mass is look at the chassis, next I look inside to see how cramped the parts are. Next thing I do is look at the different sizes of parts and wire. Next are the parts bolted down. Then I look for dampeners and things like how the power wires go from the outlet to the board and transformer. Once I get the lay of the land I begin to set the component free so I can hear what is going on.

Now not thinking of price and marketing, if I get two components in and one is built to allow the signal flow without blockage and the other is a tank, I can make a fairly reasonable guess that the simple unit (tuned) is going to beatup on the over built one. This has proven to be the case I would wager 98% of the time.

I say this because for me personally a guru looks deeper than the cover. That being the case empirically exploring units using this paradigm it puts a certain shortcut into play. Gurus know the shortcuts and gurus also don't waste time exploring the same thing over and over trying to get to the sound. I see this again and again with expensive products. Having heavy chassis and over built parts and crossovers takes points away from the status of guru-ism. For me, speakers that need complicated crossovers are speakers (cabinet and drivers) that needed to be fixed. The perfect speaker is one that can work in many rooms and with many components. That to me means a speaker that is tunable, built like a musical instrument, and one that has one or two parts to the crossover. For components, light weight, parts that are relatively similar in size (also low mass), an easy to tune chassis and a nice layout of space on the board. Also a resonant board so the parts can gel. Hardly ever with a top cover. And limited to no shielding. Shielding is a choice to be made by the listener after the unit is setup and has a chance to interact with the environment. Pretty much good products are ones that can be made to produce the sound desired after they have been acclimated to a listeners space.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net

Hi mapman

I’d have to leave that one up to the listeners themselves. Of course most of the folks who come to me are looking for that next step or even their ultimate setup including the room built variable.

This is just me as an onlooker, but most of the threads I see there are folks looking for change. Or at least the guys who have emailed me from here are looking to take a step. Not even necessarily a purchase, but a further step in their method.

Also guys keep in mind I'm not here to dictate, but instead to share the options when tuning in a system. Some of you have no desire to change anything and that's way cool, but there are many more looking toward the variables.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net