The peculiarities of a high value, low cost, amp

I've researched crown and my strong intuition is that the top end is not going to meet my standards. The mention of crown "valve" amps was interesting, perhaps a specific model could be indicated. My feeling (and research) is that crown produces a lot of power and that the amp is largely neutral, but I think I would see a loss of high end information, flattened soundstage, again- harder sound in the top end, or some combination thereof. Some reviewers mention these shortcomings. If you are sure I'm mistaken, direct me to someone who speaks thoughtfully and can provide some case-in-point examples of the dynamics I seek.

I hear wonderful things about Cherry amps, but they don't come cheap, starting well in to the two-grand range. I think I could get something amazing if I looked in the two to three grand range, but I am happy to hold out until other option bubble to the surface... 

I did bring an Emotiva amp of high power to my system, and, again, I found the top-end hard and harsher than I want. 

The combination of the Moabs and the STA200 is perhaps very slightly rolled off, and so there is absolutely zero listening fatigue. While there *might* be a very slight loss of top-end information, the vividness of the sound images throughout are absolutely captivating in good recordings. I can see, for example, that the only limitation in the sound (within the above stated volume parameters) is my ability to relax and really take in the fullness of the tapestry the system communicates. 

@mapman Ok, you've drawn me how is the soundstage? How is the 'realism' of an instrument, say a drum set, or a double-bass, a piano, etc. 

MY FAVORITE CD of the last few weeks is "Lofty's Roach Soufflé" by the Harry Connick, Jr. Trio. Gorgeous recording. Warm up your ears and system on song 1 "One Last Pitch" - get a feel for the instruments, but allow yourself to relax into "Hudson Bommer" and "Lonely Side" before drinking in the rest. You have to be able to truly slow down and appreciate the notes, the soundstage, the occasional vivid "crush" of the drum pallet. My STA200 does this CD proud. It is only the heavy bass material, in other recordings, where I find a substantive lack... I strongly sense that Crown products will not create a feeling of instruments opening upon my own living space, like my STA200.

I'm running a Schiit Saga (SS/Tube, model), and the Cambridge CD transport. Modi 3 DAC. These are my examples of inexpensive components that together amount to what is practically a revelation in audio, in my space. I owned Vandersteen 2CI's for over twenty years, and often frequented the local high-end stores. Most recently, I auditioned the Maggie 1.7's and the Klipsch Cornwall IV. The 1.7's have no bottom end, to speak of, and if I'm going to add twin REL subs to a system, I might as well look for other options. The Moabs don't need any added bass boost. I also auditioned, on two occasions, the Cornwall IV, for sale at the princely sum of $6600 and they play big. A gorgeous sounding speaker, for sure, but about $2K more than the Moabs. I don't think they are any better, although the Klipsch is somewhat easier to drive. I had not heard the Moabs, nor any other Tekton (before purchase), but I'm a researcher and I felt that the roll of the dice was worth it, plus it included a valuable "adventure" into the unknown element, and I'm not at all unhappy with the result.

These Moabs are incredibly involving speakers, and as many owners have said, they reveal everything downstream. My experience is that you really don't have to spend $2-3000 to $10,000 on every component in a system, to get the real thing: big, effortless, vividly real, involving, at times mesmerizing sound. And no, for those pondering the Beryllium, I don't think you are going to see some sort of great "improvement," only a somewhat different presentation, and the situation is such that it's almost impossible to compare the beryllium with the non-beryllium option, which is kinda cool, actually. I went non-beryllium, because I like the idea of utter coherence between drivers, and they delivery fully- the speakers sing.

I have previously cited an experience I had at a Jazz event in January, where the sound of the drum stick hitting the cymbal metal released sound that was not metal, was almost not metallic at all. The sound was of pure beauty, not harsh, not hitting, just a releasing of pure distinct, shimmering notes. The "purity" of the live event called on me, again and again, during that intimate setting. With a good recording, where the perceptive insight and planning of a sound engineer are maximized, the Moabs produce a sound event that leaves me just about as satisfied as my experience in the jazz club, back in January. I'll leave it there...

@mrdecibel I bought the cable you recommended, around the time I bought the amp you recommended - the STA200. So, the low impedance of the speakers, when the bass notes are maximized, can call for more juice than it wants to convey. The speaker/amp combo does produce some awesome "crunching" drum impact; it's the VERY big and low notes - the "the cars that go BOOM!" impacts that leave the amp somewhat withering, certainly not rising to the occasion. 

@jl35 I'm running the Schiit Saga pre. Loving the combo with the STA.

@jengelmann What tube amp are you running and how are you measure the impedance on your Moabs? Terry London claimed they were a nominal 4ohm load... I understand "nominal" to mean they do not drop below 4ohm, but I don't know that he measured the speakers...

@bigshutterbug Does the Job handle a 4ohm load? Is the power rating specified for 4ohms? How about 3.1, assuming Jengelmann is accurate... I don't want another version of the same problem I'm facing with the STA200. When I looked, I could not find a 4 ohm spec for the 225 (Job).

Where are the sellers of the Crown concept, backing up their claims with vivid examples on equivalent equipment? 

Anyone familiar with Lofty's Roach Soufflé?

@glennewdick 

Eric of Tekton did say the speakers run easily and didn't see a problem with my amp... The amp isn't really known for hard loads - they recommend not using it for 4ohm, it turns out. So, it's really not built to do what I'm asking; it may be that the Moabs are actually doing quite well on an amp that is designed for an 8ohm load. 

@bigshutterbug Perhaps it's system synergy, but LRS is crazy good on my system. Do you recommend any other recordings of Jazz with that same artful synergy that you find in the Connick album I've described? I've gotten quite a bit out of Patricia Barber of late - her work is vivid, the recordings are also vivid, her voice beautiful, but often I want to let go of words and hear only instruments, echoes of places. 

@mrdecibel Unexpectedly, I've just run into a review from August of 2013, attesting to use of the Job 225 with a pair of Thiel CS 1.7's. The minimum impedance is 2.6ohms, and now I've learned the difference between nominal and minimal impedance, perhaps... I thought nominal pointed to the lowest impedance the speaker would be expected to develop, but now it appears it sits at the other end of the spectrum for the speaker. 

Anyway, the review makes it clear that the Job can deal with low impedance without issue. It also makes it clear that the 225 has a lot more power than they are claiming, reaching up to over 200wpc with a 4ohm load. 

Interesting.

Much appreciate the responses and angles of... attack...

@mammothguy54 The GFA is an old amp, pushing thirty or thirty-five (years of age), from what I'm reading. A replacement, the 555SE is also now ten or twelve or more years since release... I think the 555ii was quite good, given what I've read, but if I'm going to put down $500, I'd rather the amp be less than ten years of age... or I'd rather put down another $500 and have something very close to new the Van Alstine SET 120 might contend. The Class D Audio offerings might be interesting. Frankly, if the Aegir can handle the load, I'm thinking of heading that direction. The review of the Aegir that I just read made it out to be a lucious sound piece... 

@mrdecibel I appreciate the claim that the Job225 might have some problems, or reasons for not being produced these days... It's not for sale, while the STA200 is still on the market. I had heard that the 225 was an unsinkable ship. If you have a moment to explain, why are we no longer seeing sales of the 225? The review I read was glowing, so you would think they would sell something that reads as a success...

@dave_b I will take a look. I thought my Yamaha days were behind me, but I will take a look.

@jetter My speakers do not have terminals for biamping, unless there is some other way to hook them up...

@douglas_schroeder You must have a great deal of experience with lower quality gear, to make such an assessment. You leave me guessing at your experiences and I wonder if you have tried the Nuforce STA200 with 8ohm speakers. Most people have been surprised... I would benefit from understanding the "fatal sonic flaws" exhibited by the amp... It sounds crazy good, to me...

This is all moving just fine...

@douglas_schroeder So, having given this some thought, including some consideration of your review work - I did enjoy reading through one of your reviews. 

Here is my quandary, given your estimation of my amplifier. You call it a "fatal flaw" and we can both see that I have had it in my system, with perhaps two occasions where the bass was undernourished. In the important songs (favs) - those where dimension, timbre, spatial cues, and utter enjoyment are the absolute intention, the amp has set the stage for, along with the Moabs, truly delicious extended, nearly nightly, sessions of listening. I need to remind you of my beer budget - not the $10 and $12 dollar bottles. 

So, you have tremendous background, so where do I go to support the bass experience, while at least maintaining the mids and highs? What can I do, given that I have a $500 amp and now want an improvement that maintains my budgetary motivations. 

How do I make the dream rise out of this mist? Can I do it for $800? $1800? $2800?