Tube Equipment: Gimmick?

Why has no-one brought up the assertations of Cheever's MIT thesis mentioned early in this thread?? Cheever claims/proves(?) that non-negative feedback (open loop) single-ended designs, either tubed or SS, are superior in TONAL QUALITY both objectively and subjectively.

Linear triodes create pleasing LOW-ORDER (2nd, 3rd, etc) distortion, while most SS designs are plagued with nasty-sounding HIGH-ORDER (5th, 6th, and up) distortion. The physiology of our ears is such that our ears actually create 2nd and 3rd harmonic distortion OF THEIR OWN in the cochlea canal. This effect serves to "cancel out" triode distortion preserving harmonic integrity. Interestingly, our ears also cancel out higher order distortion that follows a PARTICULAR PATTERN. However, most SS designs do not follow that pattern. SS may have incredibly low THD figures, but the negative feedback required to do that is what screws up the harmonic portrayal. Cheever asserts that EVEN AS LITTLE AS 3dB OF FEEDBACK will screw up the sound.

SS designs with ZERO feedback and the correct PATTERN of rising order distortion may IN THEORY sound as good as well-implemented single-ended tube designs. I'd encourage everyone to study the thesis for themselves, and post your thoughts accordingly.

Ok,

here is is, the thing i just dont get about you Tube guys.

I have repeatedly said i like tube equipment, but i prefer SS. I dont understand why people cannot accept that somebody preffers solid state amplifiers over tubes.

It seems like everyone who preffers tubes thinks that thier opinion is the only right one.

Well quite frankly, solid state has never given me listening fatigue. Maybe it is because im only 26 (27 in two weeks happy b-day me!) and my hearing is in fantastic shape and it does not fatigue me.

As for Data Numbers Testing, I know that testing is not the be-all end all. But if you set up test gear in front of the singer, and record the singing, then play it back over both forms, there will be more distortion in tube gear. Im not sayin that is a bad thing, alot of people credit that distortion to the rich full sound they are getting from tubes.

It is plain and simple, i like Solid State better. I think it is less maintenance, it saves energy (maybe not class A) and i think it sounds full, rich and involving. I like it better than Tube gear.

People like different things. That is a plain fact. Whats good for the goose is not always whats good for the gander.

Anwyays, Its too bad that alot of people seemingly cannot accept the fact that somebody preffers something different.

And to say "you just havent heared good tube gear" is just a lame statement. Does EVERYONE have to like what you like?

Hey, i like the Broncos. Does that mean if you like the Raiders that i am WRONG in liking the broncos? Does that mean that i do not have enough experience with football to appreciate the raiders?

I mean, what im basically hearing here, is that TUBE GEAR is better than Solid State gear in every aspect and everyone who does not agree with this preference is wrong.

There are alot of very intelligent and educated people on this board, i just dont understand how so many intelligent and educated people can be so naive to the fact that not eeveryone likes the same thing.

Anyways, this has just gotten dumb.

IF you all think im WRONG for liking SS gear, if you think i am getting listening fatigue when i know that i am not, then thats fine. go ahead and delude yourselves, obviously you know everything and have some sort of GOD like power to know that i get tired of listening to my crappy rig, cause i know i sure can listen to it forever without getting tired of it.

Why cant people just enjoy what they enjoy?

This is like a audiophile version of the christian crusades.

I like Dogs. I like Tbone Steak, I like fords, i like Budweiser, i like Blues, i like rock, i like reading, I like watching action movies. I like getting high and watching cheetas taking down gazelles on the discovery channel. I like working with my hands, i like drawing, i like scuplting, i like power tools, i like working out, and damnit, i like solid state amplifiers.

So, with that list, is there anything else im WRONG about liking?

I think im about done in this forum. I have all the respect in the world for tube gear, and i have all the respect in the world for your preference of tube gear. But im a SS man myself.

Peace! :)

Err, done in this thread... not forum

Cant get rid of me that easily! :)

Heheh, Slappy, no matter how many people slap you, you can't be kept down!

You're right, and I don't get it either, why do so many people need to convince others their own opinions are the correct one. Why does it matter? Listening to music is art, not science, and that's why how a component "tests" or how "accurate" it is is irrelevant to me.

For the record, I use both solid state and tubes.

Hey Slappy before you feel that you are about to be sentenced to the end of your natural life by a perpetual playing of "Pachebel's Canon" through a SET amp on a pair of high efficiency horn speakers by the SET sect of the Southern Branch of the Tube Lovers "audiophile crusaders", I would like to remind you of the following post which was in part reason for my LAST post which was in part directed for your benefit.

10-06-03: Slappy
"Its probably a lack of knowledge about tube gear.

When im able to get a good 2ch system ive been debating on going with Conrad Johnson Tube equipment, or going cheaper and buying a Krell 300i, Running some GMA Europas with either.

Im leaning more twards the Krell because i like/trust/know SS gear. I dont PREFER it because i never heard tube gear, but tubes gear looks like fun. Albeit, more maintenance is required, but im sure there is a payoff.

If i do end up getting some tube gear, i might very well opt to buy some bottlehead kits and do it that way. It would be a good learning experience and would get me into tube gear without going broke.
Ya know something, it never occurred to me that ss guys could be as passionate as tube guys."

Now Slappy, I'm gonna say it, I didn't realize you were so passionate about SS gear. If I had known this and hadn't been so ignorant in assuming that you hadn't heard the best that tubes have to offer since the above post of yours, I sure wouldn't have gone through the effort of sharing with you some of the things I really love about great tube gear and how truly great and involving it can be. Last thing in the world I'd ever want to do would be to offend or even worse convert someone so committed. Sharing a great experience to me is as enjoyable as the experience itself. Peace to you too dude.