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What Does Holographic Sound Like?

And how do you get there? This is an interesting question. I have finally arrived at a very satisfying level of holography in my system. But it has taken a lot of time, effort and money to get there. I wish there had been a faster, easier and less expensive way to get there. But I never found one.

Can you get to a high level of holography in your system with one pair of interconnects and one pair of speaker wires? I don't believe so. I run cables in series. I never found one pair of interconnects and speaker wires that would achieve what has taken a heck of a lot of wires and "tweaks" to achieve. Let alone all the power cords that I run in series. Although I have found one special cable that has enabled the system to reach a very high level of holography -- HiDiamond -- I still need to run cables in series for the sound to be at its holographic best.

There are many levels of holography. Each level is built incrementally with the addition of one more wire and one more "tweak". I have a lot of wires and "tweaks" in my system. Each cable and each "tweak" has added another level to the holography. Just when I thought things could not get any better -- which has happened many times -- the addition of one more cable or "tweak" enabled the system to reach a higher level yet.

Will one "loom" do the job. I never found that special "loom". To achieve the best effects I have combined cables from Synergistic Research, Bybee, ASI Liveline, Cardas, Supra and HiDiamond -- with "tweaks" too numerous to mention but featuring Bybee products and a variety of other products, many of which have the word "quantum" in their description.

The effort to arrive at this point with my system has been two-fold. Firstly, finding the right cables and "tweaks" for the system. Secondly, finding where to place them in the system for the best effects -- a process of trial and error. A lot of cables and "tweaks" had to be sold off in the process. I put "tweaks" in quotation marks because the best "tweaks" in my system have had as profound effect as the components on the sound. The same for the best of the cables, as well. For me, cables and "tweaks" are components.

Have I finally "arrived"? I have just about arrived at the best level that I can expect within my budget -- there are a couple of items on the way. In any case, I assume there are many levels beyond what my system has arrived at. But since I'll never get there I am sitting back and enjoying the music in the blissful recognition that I don't know what I am missing.

I should mention that there are many elements that are as important as holography for the sound to be satisfying, IMO. They include detail, transparency, coherence, tonality, and dynamics, among others. My system has all of these elements in good measure.

Have you had success with holographic sound in your system? If so, how did you get there?
sabai
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,980 posts
 
Also, hey I believe in holographic sound. THat's all that rally matters to me.

I think that there are many who have never heard "holographic sound" and may not know what they are missing. THen, once they do, it is still possible that they will not care. ITs kind of the final frontier of home audio in my mind. Many may choose to never venture there. That does not make them bad people. Their stuff might still be considered "high end" for all the other reasons.
geoffkait's avatar
geoffkait
23,365 posts
 
Sabai wrote,

"Geoffkait,
After your failed attempt to convince us that Kal Rubinson of Stereophile does not believe in holographic sound, may I reiterate:

Could you please give us the details regarding who "in the industry" minimizes the importance of holographic sound and their reasons for doing so -- and where they have actually stated this? And could you please give us the details regarding who "in the industry" actually denies the existence of holographic sound and where they have actually stated this?"

You left out the part where I said "...or believe that soundstage is artificial."

Here are a few of Kal's many statements/opinions regarding stereo imaging and soundstage. Enjoy.

"You can think and prefer what ever you like, of course. And, yes, it is fairly demanding. However, the accurate reproduction of a performance in a real space simply requires more than 2 channels/speakers. (See Floyd Toole's new book for lots of discussion.)

It is unfortunate that you, and many others, have not had the opportunity to hear what is possible with a proper multichannel music system. I believe that some of the problem is that most high-end vendors are equally in denial."

Kal

"The sound reflections accomplished with stereo speakers may be somewhat satisfying but they are not a reproduction of the original performance space and, notably, they are the same for every recording you play."

Kal

"With 2 channel stereo playing music the entire room is filled with ambiance in front of the orchestral shell extending to the directly in front of my sitting position. In other words my entire room is alive with sound, the performers up on the stage and the ambiance everywhere else. With multi-channel the center channel and the rears speakers suck out the ambiance on the sides of my room. Since I don't like sound coming from the rear anyway I tried putting the rear speakers on the sides of the room but that didn't work either. I short no where could I put 5 speakers that would even come close to the sonic realism of what 2 floor standing full range speakers can do."

That may be your perception and your preference but it is not realism. In any real-world live performance the ambiance comes from all directions. Folding it all to the front and relying on the spurious and inflexible reflections of your rooms ambient contributions is artificial. As for splitting a discrete center to the L/R speakers, that, too, creates shifts and cancellations that result in a center fill that is insubstantial compared to three across.

Of course, as ever, for what it is, de gustibus non est disputandem."

Kal
newbee
4,822 posts
 
When this thread comes up now all it does is remind me of Brer Rabbit and the Tar Baby. Forgive me for LMAO, I know some don't think this is funny. Dull day I guess. :-)
sabai OP
2,027 posts
 
Geoffkait,
I stated, "I have not heard of a single "person in the industry" or a single "senior reviewer" who minimizes the importance or denies the existence of "holographic sound". Of course, there is a world of difference between minimizing the existence of "holographic sound" and denying its existence. "

In typically cryptic fashion you replied, "Clarke Johnsen and Kal Rubinson, senior reviewers/writers at large for Stereophile magazine and Positive Feedback, respectively, to name two industry insiders, have expressed the opinion that obtaining a real, 3D soundstage is either (1) not of great importance overall or (2) not obtainable at all since any 3D soundstage is "artificial" or imaginary (in the mind of the listener). These opinions were expressed over on AA. Lord knows where their statements are archived, but somewhere, no doubt."

You seem to have an excellent memory for the content of the AA posts you site without being able to give us any specific references at all regarding exactly where we can find any specific articles or posts to verify exactly what they in fact said.

In fact, if you do an AA search on Clarke Johnsen here is the only result:

http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/t.mpl?f=general&m=382142

And, in fact, Kal Rubinson did a review of the Adcom GFA-7805 five-channel power amplifier for Stereophile. In that review he stated, "The soundstage was as wide and deep as I have ever experienced with this system, but the central images lacked some of the etched specificity I've come to expect from the Revels." It is hard to imagine a reviewer giving a positive review about a 5-channel system while talking about the depth and width of sound stage who, according to your allegedly excellent memory, "have expressed the opinion that obtaining a real, 3D soundstage is either (1) not of great importance overall or (2) not obtainable at all since any 3D soundstage is "artificial" or imaginary (in the mind of the listener)."

Hmmm.
sabai OP
2,027 posts
 
Mapman,
When you stated, "I think that there are many who have never heard "holographic sound" and may not know what they are missing ... ITs kind of the final frontier of home audio in my mind." This is what I have been alluding to in my posts.
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