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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Have the Duelund VSF now in both midranges. The only difference is CAST tweeter caps vs. VSF in other.

The difference is shocking!

They do not sound similiar at all.

A couple of guys were here today buying my Linn speakers. They came down to hear the speakers for awhile.

When they were hear the midrange was still vintage. They could not believe that was the only difference was caps.

I am very interested in Tony's review on the CAST. Somewhat dark but wayyyyy quieter. For sure not just a VSF at much more money.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Stormen you are not kidding. When I first put the CAST in I thought something was wrong?

Leaves you confused. I never thought the VSF's noisy?
I am still trying to assess this. I never in a million years thought this much difference.

What frustrates me is I keep going back to one speaker with the one with CAST tweeter caps. The problem is I will have to go one VSF and one CAST.

Which one first? The CAST or the VSF?

I am ticked now I did not wait for the CAST mid caps!

The difference (to me) is almost as big as from vintage to VSF.

The VSF's smear a lot! I can not believe this. You really under played the difference before I bought these. I understand why as never good to get someone hopes up to high. So did Burt. I see why he uses these in his horn speakers. He thought it not to be the same kind of jump as from vintage I am not so sure! They give my speakers MUCH better freq range. They take out a drone. Funny I noticed the same thing when the VSF's went in. The midrange drone went way down.

If Tony does not give these a 15 I will be shocked! They are out of the league of the VSF's. I was all hyped up before I got them expecting to get into some ideal condition to hear the difference. I never thought it was going to be massive.

I keep saying to myself these make the VSF's sound like the vintage did in comparison to the VSF's. The difference is THAT big!

My rating is if VSF's are 12.5/10 CAST is at least 15 to 17/10! Sorry to go on like this but Wow!
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Stormen did mention the break in with CAST being dark. He thought and so does Duelund that the break in was around 17 days?

For me the CAST came exactly when the cap went so a change of amps. It was VERY disorientating. The CAST is a bigger change from VSF's than ANY other cap I tried (except maybe from the worn out vintage tweeter caps)

A fundemental change for my speakers the Lascala's are known to be bass shy. They are NOT. They seem it because of the horn design amplifies all noise. So the mid and highs noise tend to give less bass.

I will be spending the money in the future to replace my VSF's for CAST for the tweeters. (I have one of each) It is THAT big.

Every person who has heard the speakers is confused as I was at first. The reaction of everyone seems to be pick the more resonating caps first then after a period of time they all switch to less resonating and can't believe the difference.

Same thing again yesterday by the guys buying the Linn speakers.

Duelund warned of break in with CAST and DO expect it. To me they are VERY dark at first like they are masking something after awhile you realize (and they open up) that they are a HUGE reduction in noise.

Listening to Sinatra yesterday the violins were much stronger out the CAST while background wayyy quieter.

The downside to this? Maybe a top notch digital front end is the only way to go. The caps have a much lower sound floor than vinyl might be capable of. Don't get me wrong it sounds astonishing but you have no doubt when you have worn vinyl on.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Now that I have found out what crossover caps can do I am replacing the electrolytic caps in the old Fishers. They are far too noisy in my opinion. I have found a review on electrolytic caps. I want to push these Duelund's to the limit and need as quiet as possible amp.

Any comments? One seems to take almost a Duelund view with silk.

http://tech.juaneda.com/en/articles/electrolyticcapacitors.html

http://www.elna-america.com/tech_audio_series.php
dgarretson
2,623 posts
 
I wouldn't pay too much attention to that URL. Perhaps the results were application-specific-- who knows what quality of other parts were in his test preamp or what compensations he needed in a filtering cap. I've used Elna Silmic(admittedly original non-II version), BG, Nichicon, and Rubycon ZL interchangeably in the PS of highly modified CDP. I would turn his list almost upside down. The Rubycon ZLs he places at the bottom of his list, particularly when placed in parallel arrays, surpassed Elna in my set-up and were approximate to BG NP. The Panasonics are also very well respected with tube DIYers. I would not be critical, had I not heard for myself how good the Rubys sound in a high end application.
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