AC Outlets

My apologies to the original poster for sidetracking his thread.

Richard wrote:

" I'm sure there is some technical reason why but I don't know it..."

It's very simple really, and also applies in a fundamental way to stock power cords versus many aftermarket power cords, ie: big differences in contact resistance to peak current. Stock outlets (and power cords) of the $3-$10 variety) have tiny points of contact that barely make contact with whatever is plugged into them.

This works fine for common household items that draw an even flow of current. A/V electronics draw current hard, off the peak and valley of the sine wave. Because of that, they are all sensitive to contact impedance. Any open connection that has poor contact integrity--whether at the panel or at the wall outlet, WILL affect performance to some degree. How much depends on the system context, how poor the contact is and and your set up.

If you were to take apart a $5 Hardware store outlet and say, a Hubbel 5362 outlet from an electrical supply house --$25, you'd see exactly what I mean. The Hubbel has massive plates that grip the pins tightly and make excellent contact, while the $5 model has 1/8" strips of metal with almost no grip or contact relevance.

Try this as a simple proof. Next time an electrician comes to visit for any reason, listen to your system prior to their arrival, then have them tighten the points of contact to the breaker/s that feed your system. Then listen to the system again. This should make anyone a believer that excellent contact integrity at every junction, from panel to outlet-- to component, matters in terms of performance. Why? Because panel connections vibrate loose over time and the reduction in resistance once tightened, is clearly audible. This is true when installing dedicated lines as well. You are essentially dedicating a breaker to the system (better peak-current delivery) and eliminating the resistance caused by branching a circuit to multiple outlets.

Really, for $25-$30 (Hubbel 5362 Spec Grade) this is a very simple, relatively inexpensive way to test the theory. It's not pseudo science, it is measurable and it does affect the (audio-video) performance of just about any carefully set up system. That does not mean that there aren't grossly over-priced, over-sold outlets on the market, there are. They exist because there IS an audible difference and some are exploiting that, just as with power cords--but that is a different discussion. This one is fairly simple and it does not strain the laws of physics or cost a lot of money to address.

This has been discussed before at some great length and there is a lot more detailed information available in the archives here and elsewhere.

To answer the OP, contact any electrical supply and request a Hubbel 5362 spec grade model. You can pursue higher end alternatives, but many will only sound different due to contact plating than offer any real measurable difference.

Regards,

Grant
Shunyata Research

This is a correction for my prior post about Hubbell outlets. I believe mine are the Hubbell HBL5362. Those that are listed as just Hubbell 5362, appear to be different. The "HBL" letters seem to be the correct ones. The 5362 without the "HBL" letters before the number must be a new series, that appear to be thinner, no brass parts, and may have not have the build quality of the HBL5362 line. Hubbell may have gone through changes, or has a another line I'm not familiar with. The letter "i" after it, stands for the ivory color. The correct one is "Hubbell HBL5362." Maybe someone else has info for this new style, without the brass. Sorry for this error.

RichardStacy, I'm not sure if your post is meant for me, but I thought you were in your sixties now. I'm not trying to make you sound older, but you do post a lot, at times. Maybe there are two Richard Stacys on Audiogon? Please don't take offence about the age part. I think one of my friends bought some cables off of you. I believe he was pleased with them. I think you and him spoke about retiring, that's why I mentioned it. I sure could be in error, and have the wrong person in mind.

Anyways, I started using better interconnects possibly before my teen years. A lot of people called them patch cords back then. They had a lot of poor ones that caused noticeable loss, and deterioration in the highs. So, I'm not one of those people that don't believe in good interconnects.

I do have dedicated power lines. Years back, my one home had an over 70 foot run to the outlet. The lamps dimmed with heavy bass passages, and there was noticeable distortion due to the power sag I believe. So dedicated runs can help, in my opinion. I have done a lot of experimenting with highly qualified Electrical Engineering friends, and talking about that would be too long for now. I'm saying this for those who think my friends, and I haven't tried all kinds of products, with no knowledge before commenting.

I also have Hubbell outlets. I've mentioned it in past threads. I have the 5362 series, and the 8300 series. I think I paid well under $10 for mine. The outlet on my refrigerator got almost hot, even though it was a 20 amp outlet. I put one of these on it, and it stays cool. That tells something itself, meaning it may have been generating noise from the poor connection. Possibly unsafe too. These are good outlets, and do grip the plug tight. I think you can find them for under $10 online at some places yet. I don't know about these sellers, but I think they are the correct ones. You could check your local area, it may vary a lot it appears. I don't recommend the under $3 ones either. There still are a lot of those around. They may not grip tight, wear fast, and are made cheaply in my opinion.

Rja,
You are absolutely correct. Experts are to be found everywhere. The proof of the pudding is in the eating. If you have a high end system, all you need to do is install a Synergistic Research Tesla Plex SE and open your ears.