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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
face
516 posts
 
Volley,
I have now heard Clarity MR's and copper Duelund VSF's in both my Tannoy's and custom speakers. I still stand by my opinion that imaging and dynamics are better with MR's. But, I could see how someone could still prefer Duelund due to their timbre. Their tonality is slightly better and they are also a little smoother. Not that MR's are harsh at all, but they don't hold anything back or color the music either.

Mike
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Mike

I would really like to know do you run the signal through the Clarity and then to the Duelund? If so I can understand you saying not that much better. I thought Duelund to not be worth the $ until run through a foil and then to the (of course foil) Duelund.

To me and I said to Frederik as good as find his caps I have found Steen's findings to be as important or more so. (really more so) My parts (output transformer) will be here shortly to fix the one really quiet Fisher I have and then I am have the caps done and from what I have found out, plastic the coupling caps will not be. I am likely to order V Cap Teflon's. So this is not just a Duelund thread (sorry Frederik) but a thread on Steen's findings who I think is really on to something. I put in one plastic cap in the circuit and night and day the tone and timbre was not real anymore. For me it is really thrilling to hear "real" sounding instruements.

Frederik alluded to it being the plastic holding a static charge. There is clearly something wrong with all the "improvements" in audio in the last 40 years when Stereophile as much as admitted a 500c was as good as anything made today. This should not be the case after 40 years a 500c should sound like an antique! I for one was embarassed when the antique x101d blew away my 10k pre/amp with all it's modern "improvements". I have to admit it took me a few months of two systems to go what the heck is going on! That is why I read his paper over and over to try and understand what he was thinking. Even Frederik said Steen used vintage (plastic free) foil until he came out with his own.
face
516 posts
 
In my custom speakers, there's only 1 cap in the HF circuit, so it would have only been the VSF or MR. In my Tannoys's, there's 3 caps in the HF circuit, the first cap everything passes through, then there is a cap in the contour filter, and a cap in a notch filter.

I made a comparison with Solen, Mundorf S/O, Clarity MR, and Duelund VSF in my custom speakers. In the Tannoys, I have run Solen, Sonic Caps, MR's, and VSF's. The VSF's and MR's have always been the clear winners. In fact, I believe both make even Mundorf S/O sound poor(soft, uninspiring).

Currently I'm running a VSF and MR's in the notch/filter circuits of my Tannoy's. It appears they mix well. In my custom speakers, MR's in the HF and bypassing the MP circuits.
ait
480 posts
 
My parts (output transformer) will be here shortly to fix the one really quiet Fisher I have and then I am have the caps done and from what I have found out, plastic the coupling caps will not be. I am likely to order V Cap Teflon's.

Ummmm....Volley?

Teflon IS plastic. In fact, it's about the most plastic plastic that plastic can be.

Or maybe Chris V has a new "natural" source of teflon - perhaps the noted teflon springs of the planet Cestus III?
fiddler
581 posts
 
"...the tone and timbre was not real anymore."

Several very HIGH-end amp and speaker manufacturers now include V-caps in their designs. Several of these same manufacturers have said publicly that V-caps are the best caps they have ever heard or "not heard". If the tone or timbre is off maybe you should look for the problem elsewhere. Just a thought :)
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