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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
My old CD player had went on the fritz laser gone so I was out listening to systems and new digital products.

I want to keep in touch with strength's and weaknesses of my own system.

Heard
Linn Majik LP12 with McIntosh tube gear Sonus Faber Speakers. ($30k system)

Heard Linn Akurate DS and Bryston gear PMC speakers. (about $50k system)

Heard 100k++ system with Silver Cables every piece on it's own line conditioner Dynaudio Speakers forget the tube Mono blocks. Crazy expensive.

Then went to where I bought my Linn Karik/Numerik not wanting to spend a ton on digital. Private guy had just a well set up system not crazy expensive. Just B&W speakers, Bryston SS amps tube pre amp Cardas cables and a sub and it sounded quite good.

At the store B&W is now showing the crossover outside the speaker. Nothing to be proud of! In my mind cheap parts for sure. WIMA caps and cheap wire wound air core inductors with no resonance dampening. Sound's Ok for cheap parts which of course is the name of the game for making money!

I am now listening to speakers to guess which caps they use? My guess is a Sonicap or Solen level poly cap in the Dynaudio's? All I could think is they could be much better. All I could think was CRAZY! I would have upgraded the caps wayyyyyy before a $3k line conditioner for EACH component and mega $ power cord! (running through a $3 tweeter cap!)

Whenever you listen to other system one can hear your own's weaknesses. None of them sound smoother even the 100k+ system but it does go down deeper.

What would be interesting is a $100k+++ system with a smoking crossover to take out the courseness.
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,506 posts
 
The Duelund Alex caps are sounding much better. I found the issue and this is one to learn from. My SS amp has a very low input impedance while my tube preamp has a relatively high output impedance. Well, I tied another SS amp with 100k input impedance and oh my the preamp and system now sing like never before with these Duelund caps. I thought something was going on that caused bass roll-off and harsh highs and it was this impedance mismatch for sure.

Very interesting lesson. The Alexander caps are very special indeed.
duelund_coherent_audio
110 posts
 
Grannyring,

Excellent, glad to hear it.
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,506 posts
 
I should also share that my system has never sounded this good. The Alexander caps are wonderful. They are extended, open, airy and so transparent. Bass is tight and so fast and powerful. I am thrilled with these and glad I decided to go for them!

Output coupling caps can really make a difference and these Duelund Alexander caps are the real deal folks.

Impedance matching is critical when pairing an amp and preamp. I have read this a hundred times and now have first hand knowledge of it. You need your amp's input impedance to be at least 10x greater then the preamp's output impedance. I had a 2-3x factor before changing my amp. The new amp gave me a 10-12x factor and that put everything in place perfectly.

I learned a great deal over the past month and hope others can learn from my findings.
undertow
1,033 posts
 
Grannyring,
What tube preamp is this and what is the output impedance?

This just kills bass if you use a 1500 ohm preamp output with a 10k amp input for sure as an example, I have first hand experience. My first project used a tube preamp like this and I put in Mundorfs back in 2005 later to find out the Solid state amps I had were REALLY low input impedance and were not driven full range due to the combination. Very dead bass, and does not go to the deepest 20 hz its rated at for sure.

I am sure most will say that at "Least" a 10 times difference is necessary. I will say 15 to 20 times is even better.

Now with SS amps I try to keep it 20,000 ohm plus input even more is better like 33,000, 47,000, 100k. Then you have run of the gamut for all preamp choices regardless how high the output impedance gets.

I also switched up preamps due to this problem years ago, now I use a Preamp with as low as 300 and 600 ohm. Some others I have seen like Conrad johnson preamps have super low output impedance some have as low as 50 ohms which will basically drive anything.

But many tube preamps have really high output impedance in the 2000 ohm range, which kills the low frequency on some amp combo's and you need anywhere in the 30k to 100k range to make them work from one end of the frequency balance to the other.
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