What is vibration isolation for?

Pbb, your discussion in this thread can be summarized as follows:

"Tweaks can not possibly make a difference".
- well, yes, they can, and here's the physics.

"That's just techno-babble"
- no, it's pretty solid physics, with no contrary theories.

"OK, Tweaks can not make a measurable difference"
- well, here's how you could measure it and tell us what those numbers are.

"You can not possibly hear the difference they make".
- actually, we do. repeatedly, predictably, and 'blinded'.

"No way they make a HUGE difference"
- Pbb, YOU are the ONLY one to use that word in this thread.

"It's like saying every single bacterium diseases someone"
- no it's more like saying some bacteria eaters taste differences.

"Ok, wiseguy, then why don't manufacturers isolate?"
- well, they do, here's a few examples

"Why don't MORE manufacturers isolate?"
- well, here's some more that do.

"Why don't ALL manufacturers isolate?"
- not all products are designed to squeeze the last 5% at 50% more cost
- but for 1-5% of the cost of the product, tweaks can help.

"You haven't proven anything"
- no, because I don't have to. You need to prove the negatives you assert.

"HO HUM. I CAN'T HEAR YOU. LALALALALALALALA"

Please take your childish comments elsewhere, and leave this discussion to users who can a) READ before responding, b) respond to the POINTS raised, c) make claims based upon experience or research, and D) most importantly, actually partake in the hobby being discussed.

Pbb, still haven't noticed a list of what you have tried in your own system and what effect if any, you noticed. Listening to music is not about "hard data", it is about engaging your spirit. Maybe the manufacturers must be as scientific as they can be, but the result is what is important, and it is your ears that cast the final vote. Can't you get off the show me the numbers dogma? I said earlier "try it, you'll like it". What have you tried, and what were your experiences?

This continuing discussion reminds me of the story of the big game hunter stalking the grizzly bear.

The hunter drawing near the beast, levels his weapon to fire but is suddenly overpowered and sexually abused.

Returning to the same spot the next day, the bear again gets the jump on the hunter and is sexually abused again.

The third time the hunter returns he is startled when the grizzly suddenly rises up from the bushes, getting the jump on him once more.

Just before the bear begins to take advantage again he asks, "You don't really come here to hunt do you?"

Bmpncyc, the only store bought isolation device I have are four rather ancient Audio-Technica feet under my Arcam FMJ CD 23. The speakers are spiked to the concrete floor of my listening room. In all honesty I can tell you that whether the AT feet are under the cd player or not, it sounds the same to my ears. The same goes for the spikes. Whether they are there or not, the speakers sound the same to my ears. No great and sudden revelation image-wise, up, down, depth, height no change in bloom, tunefulness, and all the other expressions I could use to describe the quality of the reproduced sound.

The preamp is on a makeshift stand, metal tubing on casters. The power amps are on ancient Radio Shack speaker stands, with crappy casters, the stands are not even welded but put together with carriage bolts. I have vinyl bumpers from Home Depot on the upper portion of the metal plate on which rests the preamp and on the upper portion of the square tubing where the power amps rest. That's it, that's all. I have never heard in normal listening of music any effect of having any or all of these things there or not.

Curiously enough, one of the improvements of the Arcam cd player over its predecessor is the use of isolating materials. Since I have never heard the former and since other changes have been made between the two models, I can't tell you if this better isolation has brought about better sound. One sure thing, I am not going out to borrow one in order to compare it to the CD23. If something is cheap and will provide me with an extra measure of peace of mind, I will try it. Like I said if it can't hoit. But, at the risk of repeating myself, I have not heard any significant (or insignificant for that matter) improvement with any of these devices. Again, if vibration was the cause of such problems on ss amps and preamps as believed by many here, the mere fact of displacing the equipment in the room would affect the sound. Again, whether the amps are in front of the room, to the side, to the back, I have never heard any change in the sound they produce. I have excluded turntables from any statement I made on the audible effects of vibration. I have done likewise for cd players, although it would be impossible to argue that they are anywhere near as prone to the ill effects from airborne or structure borne vibrations as the analogue tt. I have even excluded valve equipment, which has a reputation of being somewhat microphonic, although I did not notice this when I bought my AR preamp.

It is strange to realise time after time that hidebound people think that the hobby has got to match their conception. As far as I can tell the person making claims of the existence of a phenomena should have the burden of proving it in some fashion. Repeating that it is so because it is so or that any half-wit can hear, see, feel, taste or smell something is not proof, but merely arrogance. Assuming on the flimsiest of observation that something exists and then saying that it is up to the opposing side to prove it does not does not advance one's case very much.

In closing I have a sub-question to those familiar with the "industry": are powered or active speakers the antithesis of high-fidelity since the amps have no place to hide from the dreaded vibrations or are the amps used therein specially protected from vibration by esoteric and heroic means such as braced capacitors. Maybe someone with such speakers could share his/her concerns over living with such calamitous devices.

Pbb, the reason that active speakers are not more popular is because they would preclude the use of esoteric cables, isolation devices, etc. There would be nothing to tweak, audiophiles would not be able to experience the sonic virtues of various tweaks because they would be redundant. Now that's no fun is it? ;-)