"Any decent jazz pianist can play circles around a classically trained player."
Frogman
"Give me a break. You can't possibly believe this. If you do, you obviously haven't listened to the great classical pianists."
Frogman: Let me elaborate on my initial statement. I've not wanted to go there because this is not a music study venue. But, since you insist.
For instance, if one aspires to learn Jazz Piano, one has to approach the instrument from a totally different mindset than a Classical player approaches it.
Let's examine the similarities first:
Both musicians must acquire a working knowledge of music theory.
The Classical player is content with studying traditional theory, and for the most part, he/she is off and running.
The Jazz player acquires the same theroretical knowledge, and after mastering that, he/she must roll up their sleeves and really get to work! In order to become a consumate player, one has to know when/how all of the traditional rules can be changed, substituted, omitted, or downright replaced or broken.
Theoritical knowledge (study) alone of an average Jazz player requires much more than a classical player.
Scales, Rhythms, etc.
The Classical student masters Major, Minor, and Diminished Scale Harmony, and his/her study of scales for the most part ends here. Standard rhythmic forms are also explored.
The Jazz student must master the above, but in addition to them he/she must also master a working knowledge of Melodic Minor scale, Whole Tone scale, Pentatonic scale, Blues scale, Bebop scale,etc., etc...I could go on, but you get the idea.
Rhythmically, the Jazz player must acquire a vast working knowledge of everything from Latin, Salsa, and every known rhythm under the sun, for who knows when the moment may arise that a particular rhythmic tempo is required.
While Classical theory is fairly complete at this point, a Jazz player has to address the following:
Basic Reharmonization (Tritone substitution, slash chords, half diminished chords, V chords and each of their alternate extensions, Lydian, Lydian Augmented)
Advanced Reharmonization: Contrary motion, Parallelism, Ascending/Desceding bass lines, pedal points, changing the melody...it goes on, and on, and on, as this but scratches the surface. One also needs to spend time learning the styles of the past, while working on their own voice. There simply are not enough hours in the day!
This is but a very brief glimpse into what a Jazz piano player must master before he/she even takes on the task of attempting to learn to improvise.
I have some personal working knowledge and experience of the piano. I'm what one would probably classify as an average player. I write, read, transcribe and improvise music as a hobbyist. I've never had any formal study in a scholastic environment. I've many a musical friend that has. If I or any of them were merely limited to studying (learning repetoire), and focusing on technique only, we'd all be professional. It should be pointed out to the unfamiliar, that Jazz piano is no easy undertaking. It is far more involved than the average listener is hearing. And to become good, really good, takes a great investment of time, sweat, and passion for the instrument.
I dig the classics too, but nothing I've ever heard impresses me personally as much as what I've heard the Jazz greats creating. Probably because, on an average recording I can hear what's happening, and know first hand what they've mastered to get there.
Like classical, it's a lifetime undertaking. One simply cannot do justice to it as a hobbyist, but it is no less rewarding...Jazz music sells on average make up less than 3% annually. So even professionals struggle to make a living.
So, you and I share a different view between a classical and a jazz player. And that is entirely as it should be. LOL...Hey man, just call me SOFTY from now on!
It's been fun man!
Enjoy!
Coltrane1
