tube amps and electrostatics


What kinds of experiences have people had mating tube amps to electrostatic speakers (full range and/or hybrids)? I love the sound of both separately, but am concerned about the reactance of electrostats with tube power. I already own the CJ CAV-50 and am looking to upgrade my speakers with something in the $2500 range. Thanx, Dave
dabble
Thanks for the heads-up George. I'll do some checking. At this point, more from dumb luck, I may have a combo that works ok because my ARC Ref 150 has muscle power and a large reserve power supply, plus my speakers are reasonably sensitive (92 db). Otherwise, I would have been another hapless victim. I'll be smarter next time when I upgrade speakers. That's for sure.
Bifwynne, another speaker you might look at is Audiokinesis. His speakers are not only more efficient, they are also very easy loads (some of them are 16 ohms) without crazy phase angles, yet also quite musical and good bass extension.

I think you are correct that speaker manufacturers ought to be taken to task. Back in the old days when tubes were the only game in town, speakers were a lot more efficient and higher impedance. When the less expensive power of solid state came along, we saw both impedance and efficiency go down.

When transistors came along, amp manufactures realized they could build an amp with same power as a tube amp, but it might only cost 1/10th as much, yet they could still charge 90% of the tube amp retail cost. A similar thing was going on with speakers- its costs about 1/10th as much to build a lower efficiency driver (as opposed to a high efficiency driver). To get back some of the perceived loss of efficiency, the impedances headed south. IOW, its all about the dollars.

IMO its telling that you can have two speakers, one 10X more efficient, and the more efficient one can have the same bandwidth and be just as revealing, IOW not giving up anything for being more efficient.

I can't think of a good reason for a high end audio loudspeaker to be less than 8 ohms. I've mentioned this plenty of times before- the lower the impedance, the higher the distortion, making any amplifier harsher and less detailed due to the types of distortion and our human hearing/perceptual rules. IOW if you want to make a speaker that seems smoother and more revealing, all you have to do is increase its impedance (all other things being equal- same box characteristics, same crossover points). It will not be that the speaker itself is all that different, but the sound of the amp driving it will be!
"ARC Ref 150 has muscle power and a large reserve power supply, plus my speakers are reasonably sensitive (92 db)"

That's a pretty solid combo on paper that should be capable of delivering the goods with the right tweaks.

No system is inherently good. Its what you do with it (the "smart" tweaks) that matter.

"12-09-13: Bifwynne
George, I did a web search for an article that explains EPDR."

Good to see someone is starting to grasp it, I posted (link) 2 graphs of the B&W802D one that shows the impedance and phase angle as separate measurement lines, and the other graph in red that shows them combined to give the actual EPDR load the amp is seeing.
Note the big difference at 60hz and at 700-800hz where the load the amp sees, drops to almost 1 ohm (EPDR) from 3ohms (non EPDR)
http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/index.php?/topic/59228-class-d-amplification-explanation/#entry1010538
And look at the Wilson Alexia comment as well.

Cheers George