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Do I need better center ch speaker-dialog unclear?

I currently have a PSB Image Series C9 center channel. I had though this was a decent enough speaker, but have grown increasingly frustrated. For example, today I was watching the new release of Chariots of Fire that has the DD 5.1 track. Maybe it is just the big echo-y ancient rooms they shot the film in, or maybe it wasn't miked well, but I cannot discern much of the dialog. There are many other movies I have had the same problem with.

Not being satisfied with the intelligibility of dialog in movies, I recently upgraded to a seperate 5-channel power amp, using my Sony DA4ES receiver as pre-amp. I do not use any soundfields or such, just straight DD or DTS. This helped the clarity vere minimally.

This not having helped all that much, I next upgraded the speaker cable to one of Paul Speltz' Anti-cables, which have received great reviews. This, again, may have helped just a tad, but I am still having the same problem with dialog.

I am now down to the point of nothing left, that I know of, other than to consider upgrading the center speaker.

So, does anybody have any other tips short of a new speaker?

If not, can anyone reccommend a significantly better center speaker that would integate at least decently with my Legacy Signature III front mains? I can't now afford to go with one of Legacy's centers.

Thanks in advance for any advice.
mtrot
eldartford
4,262 posts
 
For dialog a speaker with restricted and contoured frequency response is most inteligible. Lousy for music though, where the center speaker should be as good or better than the Left and Right speakers.
Maybe you need to DOWNgrade the center speaker.
mtrot OP
804 posts
 
"01-03-09: Eldartford
For dialog a speaker with restricted and contoured frequency response is most inteligible. Lousy for music though, where the center speaker should be as good or better than the Left and Right speakers.
Maybe you need to DOWNgrade the center speaker."

Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately, in addition to home theater, I have gotten into multi-channel audio with DVD-A and SACD. Musical selections that include male vocals concentrated in the center channel REALLY illustrate the importance of a large center speaker. No matter what settings I select in the setup of the receiver, much of the character of the male voice is lost when using the center speaker. This is clearly noticeable by setting the receiver for no center speaker, which send the vocal to the front L/R speakers. Then you hear the voice properly.

I am on a mission to save up for a big center speaker that can both reproduce dialog and singing vocals with great clarity, and at the same time is as close to full range as I can set on my TV. I just don't yet know how much that is going to cost.
mnnc
175 posts
 
Make sure the spkr distances are set correctly and then do a channel balance on all spkrs using recvr test tone and spl meter (radio shack). Easiest way to set levels is to set channel levels to lowest setting (say -10 when range is -10 to +10), turn master volume to -10 and play test tone. Bring up channel levels until spl meter reads about 75db. This is 10 db below reference setting so you won't hurt your ears or your tweeters. Do this for all channels. Now that all spkrs/channels are in balance when watching a movie you can tell at a glace what your volume is in relation to Dolby reference level. Ex: -10 on volume during Iron Man will be 10db below reference of 105db which should be yielding approx a 95db output during movie which is quite loud. I listen at about -20 through -15 or so. Making sure the channels/spkrs are balanced is crucial. The distance is important so that the soudntrack data is delivered at the correct time to your ear thus the distance settings. If it still sounds crappy try a newer blockbuster type film...Transformers, Lord of Rings, Master and Commander etc.
mtrot OP
804 posts
 
Mnnc,

Thanks for the recommendations. My speaker distance settings are correct, 10 feet for each of the front 3 speakers. I also calibrated all speakers with my Radio Shack sound meter. The way I was given to understand to do it, and the way I did, was to set the receiver master volume setting to 0db, and then calibrate each speaker to 75db. I am not sure of what advantage your suggestion would offer me, as I would just end with a different master volume for regular listening.

The settings I was talking about, with regard to my dissatisfaction with the sound from the center, are speaker size and crossover for the center speaker. It doesn't seem to matter what crossover settings I select, in that whenever I switch the center speaker selection from "None" to "small" or "large", I lose all the bass out of male voices. I had thought that the sub would pick that up, but it just doesn't, and I have the crossover setting on the sub turned up as high as it goes, and have tried all the crossover frequencies available on the receiver.

This is why I am thinking a really big center speaker is indispensable for accurate movie dialog reproduciton.
mnnc
175 posts
 
The way I understand bass management is that either the xover in the pre or at the sub will determine what goes to/played by the sub. Does your sub have xover on/off or a disable/enable...? Set to disable/off and this lets the preamp/recvr do the crossing over. Do you have ability to set diff xover points for each spkr or is it a specific xover freq that applies to all the spkrs? If you can set individual points set to just above the spkrs lower limit and all spkrs to small. Otherwise most suggest setting xover to match the spkr/s with the highest...low end capability which is usually the surrounds. My center and surrounds freq response are rated at 65 and 55hz respectively. My xover oint via prepro is set at 60 which applies to all the speakers even though my mains (biamped nht classic 4's) are more than capable of playing solid/tight down in the 30's or better with the side firing 10 inchers being biamped. Nonetheless, basically everything at about 60hz and below is sent to sub with this setup. Spkrs are all set to small. How loud do you turn it up with everything balanced as you say it is? -15...-10db...? My buddy has a single really big Klipsch Belle that would kick things up a notch :}
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