Intuitive Summits & R.S. Audio Sasons?

Rx8man, I would like to spend my two cents. I have owned the Sason's for about 45 days. I can tell you they are in every sense of the word outstanding. I wrote a little review on these 6 months ago after I heard them at RSAD's place in LaPorte. I have owned two different pairs of Avalon's in the past and without a doubt feel that the Sason's are in a completely different league. I have also owned the Sonus Faber Amati's which do not come close to the Sason's ability to render you to musical nirvana. I strongly disagree with Ted's statement that they need 45 to 60 days of continuous play or they "sound like crap". I have 580 hours on mine and they continue to mesmerize me everytime I am in the sweetspot. It is true that they need a significant amount of break-in, however 500 hours gets you very close to their capabilities. The Sason's also do amazingly well in a wide size range of listening rooms. They are chameleon like in that regard. The sound room at RSAD is only about 12' wide and they sounded incredible in the narrow room. I have been in this crazy hobby for about 30 years and have been a musician for 35 years and can honestly say the Sason's sound like music. They provide that rare occurence of really connecting with the performers and the musical presentation. They are the most transparent design I've listened to, and their imaging and soundstaging capabilities are phenomenal, actually spooky. They are lightening fast and extremely neutral top to bottom. I owned the Sason's for a week and realized that my Vandersteen 2WQ subs and MH-5 crossovers needed to go. One word of caution- if there is a deficiency in your system, room or whatever, the Sason's will reveal it without mercy, they are all about the truth.

I strongly disagree with Ted's statement that they need 45 to 60 days of continuous play or they "sound like crap". I have 580 hours on mine and they continue to mesmerize me everytime I am in the sweetspot. It is true that they need a significant amount of break-in, however 500 hours gets you very close to their capabilities.

Rythmace4218,
You are a lucky one. Not sure why you should strongly disagree with my statement, though; it's not debatable in my experience, it happened. You can say you didn't find this to be true in your experience, but I wasn't lying about mine. The good news is that maybe Steve and co are breaking them in more. He made a point of telling me back in October last year that my pair were very fresh, and struggled to find a good position for them when he was here. We even moved the room layout drastically. After a few days I moved everything back. At about the 6 week mark they blossomed into a completely different speaker...like night and day different, and proceeded to mature for 2 more weeks. So...net/net: good news on the newer versions.

I will join you in stating that the upstream components get put under the Sason's electron-powered microscope; if they are good sources, etc. the Sasons will reward handsomely. Things like cable and tube changes are quite evident with these transducers.

I did my much-closer-to-the-front wall experiment but the soundstage depth collapsed too much. I have become so used to the you-are-there 3-D soundstaging that any compromise is too much. But doing this moving had a side benefit: I ended upmoving them slightly back on a diagonal (my system pics are not here yet, but are on another forum) re-laser aligned them, and they snapped into focus even better than earlier.

Glad this thread is picking up steam.

Interesting analysis Ehider, I like that post, and thanks Rhythmace for your input too.

I believe what's being said by what owners have been through before this stop, even before my audition !

A very intelligent group here did their speaker search quite well.

It's a nice alternative to the the same ole speakers that get beat to death on a daily basis.

Hello Post-a-teers!

Thanks Ted, Ehider and Rhythmace for taking time to post your thoughts.

Rx: I've heard rumors over some time you've wanted to make it over this way. Hope you're able to make it at some point.

The break-in thing: The Sasons do take some good time to break in and settle down. We've always said about 500 hours. Up to about 200 hours the Sason are okay - nothing too special - and they can certainly be frustrating if one doesn't keep their sights and expectations set on the 500 hour mark. After the 200 mark, healthy glimpses of what the Sasons are about kind of come and go but...mostly come the closer they approach 500 hours.

Break-in is a funny animal and while it's something that a lot of us experience in our personal systems, it seems most folks don't have enough broad experience to talk about a given product's break-in character in a wide range of installations. I think this is true whether we're talking about speakers, electronics or cables.

As a manufacturer, we're fortunate to have a lot of experience with regards to break-in in a lot of different installations - for us, whether it be our cabling or the Sasons. What we've been able to conclude is that break-in is not isolated to just the component that's been newly installed. To one degree or another, an entire system needs to re-acclimate to the new component. As all the other componentry "centers" around the new component, it's all being "exercised" differently and needs to "break-in" accordingly. I suppose it's kind of interesting this seems to never be considered or talked about. It should be at least an important consideration during the evaluation of a newly installed component. And still, I think that's just kind of the beginning! What about the AC that powers our gear and how that varies from one neighborhood to the next, whether you're in a rural or a densely populated metropolis, etc, etc. Consider that in light of the music we listen to is the AC being modulated and controlled by all the circuitry in each piece of gear. I guess ones head could begin to hurt after a while or, be encouraged that the new piece of installed gear isn't as "broke" as it might sound.

Ha! It's been some time ago but I had one Gent report that a pair of "P"!!! S/Cs took 500 hours to break in at which point he became thrilled with their performance and kept them after many comparisons to other cables. Another Gent reported that after about the 100 hour mark the cables were still sounding less than optimal. At that point he informed me he was ready to send them back. The next day I get another email from him informing me he had left the system playing for an hour or two while he went and did some chores and came back for one last listen. LOL! Transformation and he kept them! His words: "...the darndest thing I've ever heard!" Go figure! I know this, our cabling for example does not, in and of it's self require a ton of break in and they sound pretty darn good cold so, there's definitely more at play here than just the newness of a component.

All this to say I'm never surprised how different people's experiences with break-in differ. There is a myriad of things that contribute to the differing experiences. Getting an idea of others experiences can be helpful to some degree but I would set my expectations or conclusions based on another's experiences given all the variables.

So, in light of that, I wouldn't negate your lengthy process Ted. I'm just glad you stuck it out to get to the pot of gold! On the other hand, Steve and I personally set up Rhythmace's pair and another pair before that in the same town late June. Both Steve and I were surprised at how good the Sasons sounded right away in these new installations. No, they didn't have the magic they are capable of after being fully broken in but they sure as heck didn't sound as un-involving as a new set sounds in our music room or in other new installations we've heard.

So...go figure! Or, save some mental anguish and perhaps wrap your head around what I posted above. LOL!

Hope that helps a bit.

Cheers to all!

Robert
RSAD

Ooops! Correction to my post above. I forgot the word "not". Should read:

"...Getting an idea of others experiences can be helpful to some degree but I would not set my expectations or conclusions based on another's experiences given all the variables."

Cheers!

Robert
RSAD