Vintage DD turntables. Are we living dangerously?

But the gems, as far as pure turntables are concerned, are actually in the integrated turntables such as QL-Y7, QL-Y66F, QL-70A, etc., all have coreless motor and smooth sonic.

Hiho, I'm not sure what you mean by "integrated turntables"?
The QL-A7 I bought for my son has the tonearm integrated with the table and has an electro-mechanical device integrated into the plinth which operates the armlift up and down....and also automatically lifts the arm and stops the platter at the end of the record. All without interfering with the structural integrity of the arm itself...😊

Forgive me if I'm wrong....but I thought that only the TT-101 had the coreless motor?

Aigenga,

Halcro, get yourself either a single purpose turntable wall shelf (like the Solid Steel that I use) and spike the turntable to it, or a good stand and an isolation pad like an SRA or Symposium. I would put my naked TT-101 against any plinthed DD and be sure of a favorable outcome.

You're right of course and this is indeed a recommended method IF one has a dedicated rigid wall shelf like yours.
The problem occurs in a situation like mine where the shelf is shared and not dedicated...or where the shelf is heavily loaded because of the mass of the armpods (again like mine).
Mass-loading a shelf induces stresses within the shelf strata and these stresses (mainly the tensile ones) induce low-frequency 'noise' or vibrations in the shelf material.
A massive plinth can help absorb these vibrations without itself resonating especially if the plinth is mounted on slightly resilient feet.
A very low-mass plinth (like my steel cradle) is easier to precipitate into its resonant frequency and steel spikes do little to hinder this.
Most turntable manufacturers are aware of this structural feedback issue and attempt to combat it in various ways like mass, sprung suspension, air isolation feet etc. Rega believes a low-mass plinth (or even skeletal) is best when mounted on compliant rubber feet.
This structural feedback issue is so important that Mark Doehmann has designed his new turntable with a Minus K stand inbuilt into the plinth.

At any rate, I have been doing a lot of testing lately and, because I can do nothing about my shared shelf and its mass loading....I need to try and devise a solution to creating 'mass' for my cradle situation...👀⁉️
A tricky problem....

Halcro: "I'm not sure what you mean by "integrated turntables"?"

Integrated turntable just means a turntable comes with its own tonearm, unlike TT-101 or Technics SP-10 that allows you to use your own tonearm.

The QL-A7 qualifies as an integrated table, the same as a QL-7. It is essentially a TT71 with a semi automatic tonearm that has auto armlift at end of record and auto stop. The "A" means automatic version of the QL-7. I owned both QL-7 and QL-A7. They were my introduction to JVC turntables. Their later integrated turntables feature coreless motor that has a sound my ears are more cottoned to, such as QL-F6, QL-Y7, QL-Y55F, QL-Y5, QL-Y66F, etc... and the aforementioned flagship integrated table QL-A95.

Back to the QL-A7, the later integrated turntables are rather more complicated as they are completely automated with electronics that can adjust VTF, antiskating, damping, all on the fly with knobs on the front, like the one in the QL-Y66F. Very complicated electronically. It's great when it works right but it's a nightmare when it goes berzerk as it can kill your cartridge by applying too much tracking force by crushing the cantilever! For that reason I much prefer an old school tonearm like the one in the A7. Underneath the plinth of the Y66F, it has many ribbon cable connectors connected to the main board so it's a bit more complicated than the A7. Installing your own tonearm is doable but just have to be more careful.

The turntable section of these integrated units are very reliable, never had any problem with them. The electronic tonearms are a different story. If I can choose, I would like to have a QL-A70 as it has identical 14" platter and motor drive as the Y66F but with a more traditional tonearm. But the Y66F is more common and easier to find. Due to finance, laziness, and simplifying my life, the only table I am using these days is the QL-F6 with its stock tonearm mated with a Signet cartridge, hence my lack of participation in forums. It sounds satisfying to me. But the QL-A70 is always on my mind... I still have a beater Y66F in storage that, hmmm... I should put it into good use one day...

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Halcro: "Forgive me if I'm wrong....but I thought that only the TT-101 had the coreless motor?"

No, TT-101 is NOT the only JVC turntable that uses coreless motor. Look up some of the above models I mentioned.

I had a QL-Y7 briefly and sold it as a favor to a non-audiophile friend to replace his QL-A7 and he told immediately the sound is smoother with the same cartridge. I trust non-audiophile's ears than audiophiles, to be honest. Of course one can always argue they use different tonearms and it could be the attribute to the sound. But turntables with coreless motor that I heard have a fluid sound that I like and it's different from typical DD tables, a la Technics, almost like a belt drive but more concise and stable. That's just my own impression. YMMV.

There's a German JVC collector "JVC_graz" in some internet audio forums is very knowledgeable about all the different JVC models. Here's a picture of his collection of integrated tables.

http://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_forum/gallery/image.php?album_id=106&image_id=8637&view=no_count

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Great information as usual Hiho...👍
The Victor world is indeed convoluted and full of gems..
What Signet cartridge are you using?...just out of curiosity...

Regards

So Hiho,

If one wanted a Victor coreless motor unit which shared the dimensions of the TT-81/101 and had all the operating controls on the platter unit itself (like the TT-101)....I assume that these are not available as 'stand-alone'?
Is there a model in your integrated list from which I could remove the motor unit as a 'drop-in' for my TT-81/101?