Dear dover: """
I see Jonathan Carr uses a wrap on his FR64S arm tube but I do not like damping on tonearms as a general rule as it tends to suck life out of the sound and at worst smear the sound, particularly spongy or soft materials such as rubber, heat shrink, etc. """
first, things are that JC is cartridge designer and if there is a person that knows for sure the cartridge needs is a knowledged cartridge designer like JC. He knows that damping is a strictly necesity on any all metal tonearm ( raw steel or raw aluminum. Magnesium, boron and some other metals are less prone to resonate as steel. ) and that's why he likes that kind of damping with a tonearm non-damped design as 64/66.
I think that in the same thread that JC posted about I posted too ( several years ago. ) that I used a Sumiko set damping items where one of them was a piece of light " polymer " like to use it around the tonearm wand, wraping it.
second: """ I do not like damping on tonearms as a general rule as it tends to suck life out of the sound and at worst smear the sound ... """
years ago in this forum when I was talking of the after market vacuum platter hold down item that one gentleman here posted almost the same of you "" to suck life out of the sound .. """" and as you he does not like it that item. I already said it: Dgarretson can identify between those distortions but he preffers the " alive " sound.
IMHO no one can " to suck life out of the sound or smear it "" by damping a tonearm. You can't overdamp a tonearm.
Why said I that?.
: in an audio perfect world with out TT/platter/arm board/tonearm/ vibrations/resonances/feedback/generated noise/ system/room air pollution and with perfect LPs the cartridge pick up the information exist in the LP grooves and before and after the cartridge makes its transducer job what we have and pass through the tonearm internal wires is just the recorded grooves modulations with no single added " noises " of any kind and this modulation grooves music information is what you, me and every one want to listen: THE PURE MUSICAL INFORMATION that a well self damped transducer/cartridge gave us. RIGHT?
Now, that is what happens in a non existent analog audio world and no one will listen it in that way never ever.
Things are that all of us for all our audio life were and are listening to many " things/distortions "" and never the pure signal. All of us are accustomed to the non-perfect world and that's why you and many of us do not like that " suck life out/smear/ the like " kind of sound when that sound is nearer to the LP grooves modulations.
We like more alive kind of sound even if it's wrong, as I said we like it because we are accustomed to it.
That's why I posted that we have to give enough time to the totally " new " experience and I mean: months not days or weeks.
Now, I'm talking only of analog rig but a home audio system has other links: electronics, cables, speakers, room, etc. etc where are generated additonal distortions ( every kind. ) that puts all our systems far away of what is in the LP grooves modulations.
That's why I always say ( for years in this and other forums. ) that the difference between a good system and a better system are each one system distortions generated levels and that the main target ( at least for me. ) must be to mantain at minimum those distortions in each link of the audio chain and to do this we have to have the training to identify ( step by step for many self experiences years. ) at least the 80% of those distortions because if we can't do it we can't fix it and we can't know where all they comes.
When you , after listening time, finally are accustomed to that very low system distortions you can't go back: no return. When you there you can in easy way evaluate any system you listen to and even if you don't listen it because you know the system items that are the worst in that system. Here the subject is the 66 but we can talk of other " generators ".
Now, take a look to the " best " tonearm designs: Technics, Lustre, MS, Triplanar, 4P, Schroeder, today DaVinci, etc, etc. where a common characteristic is that all are very well damped, because a dedicated mechanism or the blend tonearm build damped materials. Even the SME V ( with the dynamic balanced " problem ". ) comes with oil damping.
Many of you have the faulty desined 66 and even that's a whole faulty design ( as the MS RX TT. ) you are trying to tweak those items: go figure!!!
I made and make item modifications only if the product is a really good original design and it's worth to make those up-grades. Well, that's me.
Btw, with or with out the 66/64 I do not like the KR. The only K I like is the KRSP and CoralStone but in both cases nothing to die for.
No, I'm not willing to explain in deep about because to understand it I have to explain where ( in a home system ) belongs the music and this subject alone is for a complete thread.
Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
first, things are that JC is cartridge designer and if there is a person that knows for sure the cartridge needs is a knowledged cartridge designer like JC. He knows that damping is a strictly necesity on any all metal tonearm ( raw steel or raw aluminum. Magnesium, boron and some other metals are less prone to resonate as steel. ) and that's why he likes that kind of damping with a tonearm non-damped design as 64/66.
I think that in the same thread that JC posted about I posted too ( several years ago. ) that I used a Sumiko set damping items where one of them was a piece of light " polymer " like to use it around the tonearm wand, wraping it.
second: """ I do not like damping on tonearms as a general rule as it tends to suck life out of the sound and at worst smear the sound ... """
years ago in this forum when I was talking of the after market vacuum platter hold down item that one gentleman here posted almost the same of you "" to suck life out of the sound .. """" and as you he does not like it that item. I already said it: Dgarretson can identify between those distortions but he preffers the " alive " sound.
IMHO no one can " to suck life out of the sound or smear it "" by damping a tonearm. You can't overdamp a tonearm.
Why said I that?.
: in an audio perfect world with out TT/platter/arm board/tonearm/ vibrations/resonances/feedback/generated noise/ system/room air pollution and with perfect LPs the cartridge pick up the information exist in the LP grooves and before and after the cartridge makes its transducer job what we have and pass through the tonearm internal wires is just the recorded grooves modulations with no single added " noises " of any kind and this modulation grooves music information is what you, me and every one want to listen: THE PURE MUSICAL INFORMATION that a well self damped transducer/cartridge gave us. RIGHT?
Now, that is what happens in a non existent analog audio world and no one will listen it in that way never ever.
Things are that all of us for all our audio life were and are listening to many " things/distortions "" and never the pure signal. All of us are accustomed to the non-perfect world and that's why you and many of us do not like that " suck life out/smear/ the like " kind of sound when that sound is nearer to the LP grooves modulations.
We like more alive kind of sound even if it's wrong, as I said we like it because we are accustomed to it.
That's why I posted that we have to give enough time to the totally " new " experience and I mean: months not days or weeks.
Now, I'm talking only of analog rig but a home audio system has other links: electronics, cables, speakers, room, etc. etc where are generated additonal distortions ( every kind. ) that puts all our systems far away of what is in the LP grooves modulations.
That's why I always say ( for years in this and other forums. ) that the difference between a good system and a better system are each one system distortions generated levels and that the main target ( at least for me. ) must be to mantain at minimum those distortions in each link of the audio chain and to do this we have to have the training to identify ( step by step for many self experiences years. ) at least the 80% of those distortions because if we can't do it we can't fix it and we can't know where all they comes.
When you , after listening time, finally are accustomed to that very low system distortions you can't go back: no return. When you there you can in easy way evaluate any system you listen to and even if you don't listen it because you know the system items that are the worst in that system. Here the subject is the 66 but we can talk of other " generators ".
Now, take a look to the " best " tonearm designs: Technics, Lustre, MS, Triplanar, 4P, Schroeder, today DaVinci, etc, etc. where a common characteristic is that all are very well damped, because a dedicated mechanism or the blend tonearm build damped materials. Even the SME V ( with the dynamic balanced " problem ". ) comes with oil damping.
Many of you have the faulty desined 66 and even that's a whole faulty design ( as the MS RX TT. ) you are trying to tweak those items: go figure!!!
I made and make item modifications only if the product is a really good original design and it's worth to make those up-grades. Well, that's me.
Btw, with or with out the 66/64 I do not like the KR. The only K I like is the KRSP and CoralStone but in both cases nothing to die for.
No, I'm not willing to explain in deep about because to understand it I have to explain where ( in a home system ) belongs the music and this subject alone is for a complete thread.
Regards and enjoy the music,
R.