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Single ended vs xlr balanced

I have switched backwards and forwards (going slightly mad in the process) testing (long run) interconnects.
I know some sound engineers, and they tell me I am probably persuading myself that balanced is better than single ended and THERE IS NO REASON WHY SINGLE ENDED CAN SOUND INFERIOR TO BALANCED. Sorry to use capitals but this seem to be a fair summary of the be all and end all of technical discussion. If I was to guess however, my mind would tend to follow the technical opinion not go against it, surely? In my mind the balanced is a deeper more airy sound, just better presence all round. The technical response is that I am not comparing like with like, as the balanced runs at higher voltages and subsequently higher volume (6db). I had a shock at this news and found out therefore by accident that my Bryston 28bsst2s amps have a switch upping the output from 23 to 29db to compensate. Also did I hear properly that Bryston kit is set up preferring balanced? My processor is a Bryston sp3 so maybe my preferred balanced system  is what I needed anyway. But it is odd that a reputable company like Bryston would have such a policy (if it has foundation) and not stress that on their literature. If my system can be adjusted for speaker levels then volume output is irrelevant - or is it if that higher voltage has some effect?
And don't get me started on aes/ebu vs spdif! The aes to me is noticeably superior for the same reasons as the rca vs xlr debate. Then hdmi vs spdif ... (Time for my medicine ........)
So my question is - forgetting technicalities which can get more and more complicated by the minute  - do other peoples' ears agree with mine?
tatyana69
almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
There is no absolute rule as to which will sound better.
It is entirely
(a) system synergy as-a-whole dependent in the first part, and
(b) the equipment and IC (both) build quality dependent.
I agree completely. 

In general, I would expect that among the most significant variables would be the specific designs of the interface circuits in the components that are being connected (i.e., the stage in each component that drives or receives the signal to or from the cable), and also the internal grounding configuration of each of the components (especially the relation between circuit ground and chassis ground), and also in the case of balanced connections whether the components connect the ground conductor in the cable (XLR pin 1) to chassis or to circuit ground.  Different designs vary in all of those respects.

Regards,
-- Al

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bdp24
10,008 posts
 
And don’t forget Ralph Karten’s (Atma-Sphere) argument that balanced cables minimize the sonic artifacts of single-ended cables.
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
Regarding Ralph’s contention that bdp24 referred to, for a full description of what is necessary for that benefit to be realized, as well as for what I consider to be a compelling proof of his contention, see Ralph’s (Atmasphere’s) post near the beginning of this thread. Also see the follow-up questions I presented to him later in the thread, and his response.

Regards,
-- Al

tatyana69 OP
269 posts
 
Not sure if I see any conclusion ... but if I did would it be that balanced if done properly/right kit must be better than unbalanced if done properly/right kit?
erik_squires
16,430 posts
 
It's important to note that pro gear is different than consumer gear. Pro gear usually converts the balanced signal to single-ended immediately, and feeds it's inputs with that, until it's output, when it is again balanced by adding a negative phase op amp stage to drive the (-) pin.

Consumer gear may be fully balanced, meaning you have two sections working in opposition from input to output, the idea being that any crossover effects or distortions will be canceled out. In these cases it may be better. Also, some amplifier inputs I've seen such as from B&O and Hypex are really balanced input only. There's a paper that goes into more detail at the Hypex website on balanced inputs.

There is one big reason why balanced may sound better that your engineer friends aren't thinking about.  Ground loops. Balanced systems don't ground a pin, meaning if there's any ground voltage imbalance between a pre and amp, it won't be part of the signal chain. With an RCA connector it almost always must be. When I worked in pro gear, we had to deal with single ended signals, but always kept the signal ground disassociated from the chassis and safety ground.  Not a lot of consumer gear goes through this much effort.

Best,

Erik
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