Is the "standard" Linn Sondek LP-12 surpassed by newer turntable brands and designs??


More than ever, the infamous Linn Sondek LP12 turntables appear for sale on Audiogon. The price of each piece varying based on the age, condition, and how many authorized factory upgrades have been done .

The question is: Is the "standard" ( without any upgrades) Linn LP-12  outperformed by newer brand turntable designs??  It seems to be getting long in the tooth as a viable high end turntable

Can someone explain what made the sound quality of this table so special and so sought after??  Is  a USED standard Linn LP-12. really worth the money??   Thanks 

sunnyjim
While I do own an LP12 that is far from basic, I would choose a VPI Prime over a current entry level LP 12. However, at its best, an LP12 is still a very musical table. 

Dear Jim,

I cannot comment on the current base level LP12 but I can describe "used" versions of it (and if you are interested, comparisons between the ultimate maxxed-out Linn LP12 vs other top-level turntables)

Like many I formerly owned a 1980s Valhalla-ed LP12.

Idiosyncracies aside, IMO, it is a very musical turntable . The sound is distinctly different from more “neutral” sounding T/Ts such as the Clearaudio & VPI ranges and those of similar design. Bottom line is that if you had been an LP12 user for decades you would find the sound of those tables unrewarding and unsatisfactory (and, dare I say, almost boring ;^).

The Linn has an ability to vividly render the music. Low level detail is similarly vivid and accentuated in a way that doesn’t happen with those other tables. For those of a more puritanical mindset, the Linn is not technically or dynamically correct but it isn’t something many would find objectionable, even if they were aware, and it’s unique sound can make most recordings exceptionally entertaining.

To cite the example of Arthur Salvatore. According to his own reports, he had one for a short time, got rid of it, then later purchased another because (I’m guessing) he wasn’t quite sure what he was missing but was probably convinced at the time he was missing something! :D

Since then he seems have fully-formed an opinion but quantifying the LP12 sound can be an elusive process.

(I should also state the disclaimer that I don’t necessarily subscribe to any particular person’s views on the LP12 but accept that they have their own opinion)

The Linn seems to perform particularly well with its own ancillaries (Ekos/Ittok and Linn carts) and can also be enhanced by using those in conjunction with Naim pre-amps of that era e.g. NAC32.5. Bearing in mind that the Naim’s integral phono PCB was handling a signal little greater than 100 micro-volts the results were staggeringly good compared with expensive and highly rated SS stages from other manufacturers, which could appear artificial and “reproduced” (or “unnatural”) by comparison.

BTW, the pedigree of the NAC32 line can be traced back to the days of the legendary Linn/Naim/Isobarik tri-amped systems of the 70s. Hearing that setup for the first time could be categorised as a memorable Hi-Fi milestone in the same way as one’s first exposure to the Quad ESL-57. It was a game changer that had profound effects on the industry for many years to come. In fact Linn’s market presence was so powerful that alternative designs such as Oracle & Michell had great difficulty breaking through because nearly every hi-fi publication was pre-disposed to recommend the LP12 above all else!

If one was seeking musical holograms or 3D living musical sculptures then this was one way to get them.

Of course these results hinged on the Linn being pampered and treated to its own dedicated and tailored mechanical support (allied to mounting that support with perfect stability on a solid concrete floor). In this regard it is even more critical than many other current suspended sub-chassis designs. Poor attention on the part of the user to this particular detail can make the LP12 sound quite ordinary. It is a design where such fastidiousness is rewarded.

(Note : Contrary to claims the suspension doesn’t drift “out of tune” if it has been properly set up and you elect not to have it adjusted/re-tuned every few years.)

So what you have here is something that, in its way, can be more “addictive” than almost anything else out there but there must be a willingness to pander to the forementioned details. You should also note that, long ago, Linn discontinued support for the Valhalla PSU. If a replacement is needed then the Hercules II is the recommended alternative (and usefully also gives it switchable 45 RPM capability).

With the latter you will have to crank the startup by hand i.e manually spin the platter to help it up to speed but to a much lesser degree this was always the case with the Valhalla. Once there it’s fine.

Hope this "sojourn through the archives" proves helpful ;^)

Great reply moonglum. I keep my 80's LP12 Valhalla Ittok on standby in case I get fed up with my 401. Or if it breaks. So far, I have used it once. I did enjoy the Linn for many years but against the 401, it is outclassed.

To Moonglum, Thank you for the history lesson on the LP-12. I gather that regardless of its overall performance, it was an analog tinkermen's  holy grail. Its greater perfection could be achieved by the factory upgrades.  Overall,  it seems like that set-up, and ancillaries were necessary to bring out its peak performance, and any faux pas along the way reduced its additive euphonic sound quality, and the buyer's investment. Not exactly a turntable for the impatient.  Unlike vintage wine, the LP-12 was not going to improve over time, it seems to require continual special nurturing

OK, enough with the mixed metaphors; I am sure over the decades  the LP12 sound quality was unassailable.   As I noted before, more than just occasionally, LP-12 are popping up on Audiogon.. 

Actually, as a prelude to creating this thread is  a good condition LP12 is on sale with the Valhalla upgrades and sporting a Grace  707 tonearm   A tempting combo,, though based on some of the points you make, too much of a gamble for me.  Thanks

  ..To noromance,  who makes the 401 TT you mention in your reply??