Grounding Metal Outlet Boxes and Isolated Ground Receptacles


Just installed six really nice separate dedicated 20 amp lines (with 6 awg) for my new dedicated listening room.  Decided to use heavy metal outlet boxes so that I could make my six Furutech Receptacles as strong and sturdy as possible.  I also had my electrician run 4-wire 6 agw to the boxes so that we could have one ground wire to the metal receptacle box and then a separate ground wire to the isolated ground screw on the Furutech.

I sent some photos of the setup to a friend of mine (who just happens to be an electrical engineer) and he raised an the issue that since my Furutech Receptacles are metal and they will be screwed into the metal box with metal screws, then we have effectively now tied the two separate grounds together!  Help!  Is that a bad idea?   Is having the box and receptacle setup in this way going to cause issues once my gear is in place; ground loop hums, etc?






stickman451
Always follow code first. The use of plastic boxes are not legal in many areas. Nor is armored cable and romex 
Given what you posted I’m assuming 1900 4 by 4 deep boxes were used and emt is the conduit. Running a separate ground is pointless. The screws and or outlet mount fins is what grounds it. The reason there is a seperate ground screw on the outlet is because there has to be. Grounding screw on all outlets. It’s there for when metal is not used as the transmission. I.e... using a plastic box

#6 is overkill. Amplifiers draw between 2 and 4 amps max

depending on what your running I would have ran two dedicated 20 amp on min #10 wire on a shared neutral.

the outlets you bought are good but so is just about any hospital grade. I’d be surprised if a furutech accepts #6 wire.

verify the panel is grounded correct. Tap after your main water shut off and jump to before the shut off valve

cheers
bimmer528 6 posts 12-18-2016 10:34pm

Always follow code first. The use of plastic boxes are not legal in many areas. Nor is armored cable and romex
Given what you posted I’m assuming 1900 4 by 4 deep boxes were used and emt is the conduit. Running a separate ground is pointless. The screws and or outlet mount fins is what grounds it. The reason there is a seperate ground screw on the outlet is because there has to be. Grounding screw on all outlets. It’s there for when metal is not used as the transmission. I.e... using a plastic box

#6 is overkill. Amplifiers draw between 2 and 4 amps max

depending on what your running I would have ran two dedicated 20 amp on min #10 wire on a shared neutral.

the outlets you bought are good but so is just about any hospital grade. I’d be surprised if a furutech accepts #6 wire.

verify the panel is grounded correct. Tap after your main water shut off and jump to before the shut off valve

cheers

//

Always follow code first. The use of plastic boxes are not legal in many areas. Nor is armored cable and romex
Actually, I would be willing to bet they are approved for use in most single and multi family residential dwelling units in the US.

Yes, there are a few exceptions.
AHJ (Authority Having Jurisdiction) has the final say.

NEC Code adoption by State.
http://jadelearning.com/jadecc/nec_code_adoption.php

//

Given what you posted I’m assuming 1900 4 by 4 deep boxes were used and emt is the conduit. Running a separate ground is pointless. The screws and or outlet mount fins is what grounds it. The reason there is a seperate ground screw on the outlet is because there has to be. Grounding screw on all outlets. It’s there for when metal is not used as the transmission. I.e... using a plastic box
You? I guess you are addressing me.

Yes, a 1900 box is a 4" X 4" square box.

As for running a separate equipment grounding conductor in an EMT conduit technically per NEC code it is not required. The metal conduit is an accepted approved equipment grounding conductor, with some exceptions.
2014 NEC 250.118 Types of Equipment Grounding Conductors.
Of course the AHJ has the final say. They may require a conduit/box ground wire.

The screws and or outlet mount fins is what grounds it. The reason there is a seperate ground screw on the outlet is because there has to be. Grounding screw on all outlets. It’s there for when metal is not used as the transmission. I.e... using a plastic box

How about where the branch circuit wiring is NM and the outlet box is metal?
How about if the Yoke, supporting back strap, does not come into solid contact with the box, and or raised device cover, for a flush installation and the receptacle used is not an approved auto ground type?
How about if a surface mount 4" X 4" square box is used and the receptacle is mounted to the back of a steel raised receptacle cover.
Lots of how abouts. The ground terminal is there because NEMA, NEC, UL, ect, says it shall be there.
//

depending on what your running I would have ran two dedicated 20 amp on min #10 wire on a shared neutral.
That meets bare minimum NEC Code. Sucks for audio equipment though. Especially for audio equipment that is connected together by wire interconnects.

For the layman reading this post multi wire branch circuits, (in this instance 2 separate hot conductors, breakers fed from L1 and L2, and 1 shared neutral conductor. Per NEC the 2 separate circuits shall be fed from a 2 pole breaker.)

Note: Two 120V separate circuits..... NOT two 120V dedicated circuits...

How a shared neutral works.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVamt9IdQd8

//

bimmer528,

Who installs multi wire branch circuits today?

NEC code is bare minimum.

National Electrical Code 90.1 Purpose: -

(A) Practical Safeguarding. The purpose of this Code is the practical safeguarding of persons and property from hazards arising from the use of electricity.

B) Adequacy. This Code contains provisions considered necessary for safety. Compliance therewith and proper maintenance results in an installation that is essentially free from hazard but not necessarily efficient, convenient, or adequate for good service or future expansion of electrical use.

FPN: Hazards often occur because of overloading of wiring systems by methods or usage not in conformity with this Code. This occurs because initial wiring did not provide for increases in the use of electricity. An initial adequate installation and reasonable provisions for system changes provide for increase in the use of electricity.

(C) Intention. This Code is not intended as a design specification or instruction manual for untrained persons.

(D) Relation to Other International Standards. The requirements in this Code address the fundamental principles of protection for safety contained in Section 131 of International Electrotechnical Commission Standard 60364-1, Electrical Installation of Buildings.

FPN: IEC 60364-, Section 131, contains fundamental principles of protection for safety that encompass protection against electric shock, protection against thermal effects, protection against overcurrent, protection against fault currents, and protection against overvoltage. All of these potential hazards are addressed by the requirements in this Code.


http://www.spgs-ground.com/information/-purpose-of-the-national-electrical-code

//

the outlets you bought are good but so is just about any hospital grade. I’d be surprised if a furutech accepts #6 wire.
I suggest you go back and reread the OP’s posts....

//

verify the panel is grounded correct. Tap after your main water shut off and jump to before the shut off valve

I believe the OP has a sub panel that is feeding his audio equipment's dedicated branch circuits.

Best regards,
Jim
.
Addressed well Jim ;)

i am in Chicago, very strict here on what can and can't be acccepted. 
bimmer528 said:
i am in Chicago, very strict here on what can and can’t be acccepted.
That’s an understatement.

I assume this is current electrical code for Chicago.

Chicago IL Residential Electrical Code.

RESIDENTIAL WIRING:

A.

All wiring changes or additions to electrical systems in residences previously constructed should be rigid or electrical metallic tubing where possible and all basements should be in conduit.

1.

Where necessary to fish through existing partition, BX or flexible conduit may be used and must terminate within twenty-four inches (24") of its entrance into any basement or crawl space area.

2.

Where a question exists as to methods or materials used, the ruling of the Electrical Inspector shall govern.

3.

All conduit on or below grade, shall be galvanized rigid conduit PVC (Minimum Schedule 40 Poly Vinyl Chloride), rigid conduit to be used in concrete only.

(No. I.M.C. Steel) burial depth a minimum of twenty-four inches (24").

B.

All wiring systems installed in new residences shall be in rigid conduit or electrical metallic tubing.

1.

Junction boxes may not be installed in inaccessible or concealed locations. This does not exclude use of said boxes in basements, crawl spaces or attics. Junction boxes may not be installed under overhang or decorator or soffits.

2.

Said conduits shall be installed on what is known as the "loop system" and shall be completed between the approved outlets, having not more than four (4) right angle or equivalent bends including those at the outlets.

C.

All service entrance conductors shall be installed in one and one-fourth inch (1¼") conduit or larger if required. All new services must be in rigid metal conduit, meter sockets and panels are to be installed with butterfly bolt or anchors and have a branch circuit panel with a minimum capacity of sixteen (16) poles.

1.

Underground services shall be installed as approved by the local public utility rules, as filed with the Illinois Commerce Commissioner and must be at least two (2) No. 2 gauge wire and one No. 4 wire for neutral conductor. For direct burial, wire approved for that use must be installed.

2.

There shall be no splices in any wire approved for direct burial.

3.

Connections between outside meter fittings and inside service connecting device must be run in outside of building as much as possible and be installed in conduit without the use of concealed fittings.

4.

For a single-family dwelling, the service disconnecting means shall have a rating of not less than one hundred (100) amps. Service entrance conductors shall be not less than two (2) No. 2 gauge copper or approved 4 gauge copper wire, approved for use.

5.

Two-family houses shall have a one hundred (100) amp disconnecting means for each family unit. Service entrance conductors for two-family houses shall not be less than 3/0 gauge copper wire and one No. 1/0 gauge copper for neutral wire. For three (3) to six (6) more meters the service riser will have to carry a one hundred (100) amp for each meter.

D.

In all cases service entrance conductors must be adequate for the connected load.

E.

Grounding for combination systems and equipment, grounding to be done with No. 4-B & S gauge, copper or equivalent current-carrying capacity; wire run directly from neutral in service disconnecting or distribution box to the street side of the water shut-off valve, where said valve is inside of the building.

1.

In all homes without basements, of slab or other construction, entry of water service or shut-off valve shall be the location of ground locations.

2.

On approved two-jaw type, one ground clamp of metal similar to that attached shall be used.

3.

Said ground wire must be installed under basement concrete floor.

4.

Ground wire may be solid, stranded bare, insulated or of weather-proof type No. 4.

5.

Electrical ranges may be grounded to the neutral conductor. No other cabinet or appliance can be grounded to the neutral conductor.

6.

Bare neutral can be used only on service entrance as far as supply disconnect device.

F.

Rooms not now wired or additions to homes now built, shall be done by the rules covered herein and also shall have at least one circuit for each five hundred (500) square feet of area for general lighting purposes.

G.

Each single-family home or separate apartment shall have its own disconnecting device located as determined by the 1993 edition and later editions of the National Electrical Code and the Electrical Inspector.

H.

Each single-family home or separate apartment of multiple dwelling occupancies shall have at least two-appliance circuit, wired with No. 12 B & S gauge wire and may be fused at twenty (20) amperes, to supply the receptacles located in kitchens, dining rooms, dinettes, breakfast room, pantry, utility rooms and laundry. No lighting shall be installed on this circuit.

1.

Outlets for electrical clocks cannot be on this circuit.

2.

Receptacles shall be installed on the wall, two feet (2’) from the laundry tray in the laundry room and shall be a three-pole type suitable for grounding purposes. Recommended use of one of the types now available and suitable to receive present two-prong type of attachment plug now in general use. Receptacles or switch installations in garage areas must be mounted not less than fifty inches (50") from finished floor.

3.

Combination light and receptacle outlets may not be used in place of laundry outlets required.

4.

Certain other laundry equipment, such as dryers, may be required to be on separate circuits according to the loads used and judgment of the Electrical Inspector.

I.

Heating or air conditioning systems are to be on separate circuits and to a switch installed on or near the equipment disconnecting ungrounded conductors.

If

No. 12 size conductors are used and less than twenty-five feet (25’) in length, then the sub-main terminals may be used, provided a fuse-type switch is used at the equipment.

J.

No circuit wired with No. 12 B & S gauge wire should have more than thirteen (13) outlets or receptacles for general lighting purposes connected thereto.

K.

No circuit wired with No. 14 B & S gauge wire should have more than ten (10) outlets or receptacles for general lighting purposes connected thereto.

L.

In any case a circuit shall be able to carry any load connected thereto.

M.

All outdoor or entrance outlets should have an outlet box suitably installed and waterproofed, must be on ground fault.

N.

Ceiling joists may not be notched for installation of conduit without written permission of the Electrical Inspector. Ceiling joists or studding may be drilled for conduit installation.

O.

All conduit run on top of the ceiling joist shall be run straight and at right angles to the joist and strapped thereto. Conduit run parallel to the ceiling joist shall be set down beneath the top edge of same.

P.

All exposed runs in basements or other locations should be installed in a neat and workmanlike manner.

Q.

Ceiling joist shall be notched one-eighth inch ( 1/8 ") for bar hanger installation.

R.

All outlets for general lighting purposes shall be one and one-half inches (1½") in depth and three and three-fourths inches (3¾") in diameter of 1900 type of box.

S.

Switch and receptacle box shall be 1900 or four inch (4") square by one and one-half inch (1½") type of box set flush with studding.

T.

On dry wall construction a flat type of outlet cover box shall be used. Otherwise all covers for outlet boxes shall be at least one-half inch (½") in depth.

U.

Where three and three-fourths inch (3¾") octagon box is used for ceiling outlets, the shallow offset type of box shall be used to bring the outlet box to the edge of the rock-lath or other material.

V.

The box should be installed to come within one-fourth inch (¼") of the finished surface.

W.

Wires not to be drawn into conduit until wall finishes are applied or all mechanical work is completed without written consent of the Electrical Inspector.

X.

Hot travelers for three-way switches are not allowed.

Y.

All fuses shall be of the approved time delay type "S" or breakers.

Z.

Metal fixtures installed over kitchen sinks or in bathrooms shall be mounted so as to be grounded and controlled by wall switch.

AA.

Outlets in closets shall be installed in the ceiling close to the door. Brackets can be used only over doorways.

BB.

All circuit splices shall be made with approved connectors.

CC.

At least one wall receptacle for each twelve feet (12’) of lineal wall space as measured horizontally around the room at the baseline, including all door or window openings in all living rooms, bedrooms, dining rooms, library rooms and kitchens. Receptacles not to be installed in floor unless of the approved type and must be within two feet (2’) of the wall to be counted as one required above.

DD.

All boxes mounted back to back to be firmly bolted together or nippled between, to insure continuity of ground. All connections, couplings, locknuts or bushings to be set up tight.

EE.

All recessed lighting outlets to be connected with approved wire suitable for the purpose and have temperature rating of one hundred fifty degree centigrade (150°C). Not more than one conduit may be run to any direct or recessed lighting fixture unless run to a junction box outside of fixture in the manner approved by the Electrical Inspector.

FF.

Installation of household electric ranges of not more than twelve and three-fourths (12¾) K.W. capacity may be installed in three-fourths inch (¾") conduits using two (2) No. 8 gauge and one No. 10 gauge wire.

GG.

Porcelain pull-chain type of fixtures must have insulator between pull-chain and attached chain. No grass shell type of sockets allowed in basement or other damp areas. All drop cords shall be of the type approved for locations used.

HH.

Three-wire branch circuits are approved, providing the conductors are of different colors and other than white and providing they are so connected as to apply two hundred thirty (230) volts across the phase wires. Otherwise two-wire circuits must be run. If more than one three-wire circuit is run in the same conduit, then all underground conductors should be of different colors.

II.

In general, rules and regulations included in the 1993 Edition and later editions of the National Electrical Code are herein implied.

https://www.municode.com/library/il/north_chicago/codes/code_of_ordinances?nodeId=TIT12BURE_CH14ELRE...

The city Electrical Department is still following some of the electrical standards of the 1993 NEC, (National Electrical Code). I find that incredible they have not kept up with NEC since 1993. LOL, NEC is updated every 3 years.

The mandated requirement that rigid conduit, EMT, must be used in single family dwellings, houses, in 2016 is just plain nuts.

As an outsider of Chicago looking in it appears to me the central governing body, power, of Chicago is/has been for years, bought off by the Electrical Contractor Lobby. As I read some of the code requirements I seen unnecessary $$$$$ in added material and labor costs that drives up the building cost of a new home, built in Chicago.

No mention what so ever of AFCI (Arc Fault Circuit Interrupter) protection any where in the code. Of course in 1993 they did not exist. Not until 1999 did NEC first speak of branch circuit arc fault protection. In 2001 NEC required AFCI protection on all branch circuits feeding receptacles in bed rooms. By NEC 2008 their use was expanded followed in other areas of the home. NEC 2011 even more expansion, and even more in NEC 2014. Electrical acing is one of the biggest causes of electrical fires in homes.

My guess is the governing body of Chicago is aware of the NEC requirement for AFCI protection in residential units. They just don’t want the general public to know. Why? How could they then justify the mandated requirement for rigid conduit in homes for all branch circuit wiring? $$$$$$

http://structuretech1.com/new-electrical-safety-requirement-afci-receptacles/

http://www.codecheck.com/cc/ccimages/PDFs/AFCIsComeOfAge.pdf

Jim
.
EDIT:

jea48 said:
The city Electrical Department is still following some of the electrical standards of the 1993 NEC, (National Electrical Code). I find that incredible they have not kept up with NEC since 1993. LOL, NEC is updated every 3 years.
That may not be accurate.

From the supplied Link,
In general, rules and regulations included in the 1993 Edition and later editions of the National Electrical Code are herein implied.
bimmer528,

Is AFCI protection required in new homes built in Chicago today?

Are they required if new branch circuits are added in an existing home?
For the rewire of an older home?